Re: [ee_shoppahs] X86 clones
- From: "Jack L. Poller" <poller@xxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <ee_shoppahs@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Tue, 6 Jul 2010 15:54:20 -0700
I worked with the origins of the AMD team - they started out at NexGen,
which was bought by AMD. The same team did Montalvo, Siara/RedBack,
and PA Semi (I think). I was also with Chromatic Research, creating an
x86 clone funded by SGS Thomson and the Koreans.
Like the Cyrix team, they're really sharp. You have to be to create
a processor.
However, there are 3 fundamental issues that make it extremely hard to
create a clone:
* Resources - dollars, people, technology. Montalvo budgeted on the
order of $80 million per year, with a staff of over 100 circuit
designers. Chromatic had 100+ circuit designers as well.
* Compatibility - Making sure that you are a perfect clone is
extremely difficult. Montalvo's claim was that they had a working
x86 VM. The designer of the VM was one of the first employees
at Montalvo
* Profit - Intel owns their own FAB. If you don't own your own
(which is now a $5 Billion investment), you're at the mercy of
the FABs. This is both a profit and time-to-market issue.
Jack
-----Original Message-----
From: ee_shoppahs-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:ee_shoppahs-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of John Laverdier
Sent: Tuesday, July 06, 2010 9:44 AM
To: ee_shoppahs@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: Re: [ee_shoppahs] X86 clones
Julian,
Interesting subject, here's what I know of Cyrix.
I worked for Cyrix - did the floating point unit in their
686 generation. That was a really smart bunch of engineers.
They competed head to head with Intel for over 10 years, and
survived by targeting the low end of the price curve. In other
words, 70% to 80% of the performance for 40% to 50% of the cost,
and their chips included graphics engines, and ALL of the peripherals
built in (ports, keyboard ctlr , disk ctlr, memory ctlr etc).
They accepted a takeover bid offer from National Semi, because they
were having issues with the IBM fabs. National drove them into
the ground in less than 2 years. Fab problems even worse - Sad story.
L8R
PS. Ran the sales tax concept past a conservative buddy here at
Raytheon this morning - he liked it, said it was similar to the
Value Added Tax (VAT) thing that has been making the rounds, but
he lost me on some of the details.
--- On Tue, 7/6/10, J Fields <j.email.fields@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
> From: J Fields <j.email.fields@xxxxxxxxx>
> Subject: [ee_shoppahs] X86 clones
> To: ee_shoppahs@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Date: Tuesday, July 6, 2010, 4:19 PM
>
http://www.electronicsweekly.com/blogs/david-manners-semiconductor-blog/2010
/07/suns-x86-clone.html
>
> "Cyrix, Rise Technology, Transmeta, IDT's WinChip,
> Meridian, Metaflow,
> MemoryLogix, Montalvo -
> all of these were failed x86 clone attempts - and,
> according to the
> New York Times, there was nearly another x86 clone from
> Sun."
>
> I don't know about "failed" since Cyrix sold millions of
> their chip.
>
> Wonder what you guys think of the clone market?
>
>
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