Neville If your using Sonar 5, you must scan them with the VST Configuration Wizard. It's under tools. For step by step instructions and explainations, go to the Sonar help and put VST in the index help pane. HF ----- Original Message ----- From: neville To: ddots-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Sent: Thursday, December 28, 2006 10:50 AM Subject: [ddots-l] a message for phil Hey Phil I remember sometime on the list you mentioning a website called digitalfishphones. I went on there web site to download there plugins and now I'm trying to get them to work with Sonar. I'm assuming that you've gotten them to work. So, I'm wondering if I can get some assistance from you. After I unzipped the files I cut and pasted them into the folder that holds all my VST plugins just like what the manual said to do, but with no results. It appears that Sonar doesn't see them. When I go to my effects bin and press the applications key then E for audio effects, I can't find them in the list. What do you think?