Clay,
Interesting and I agree that color can vary by monitor, processing etc, so
now I just try and leave, as is, as much as possible.
And just having had cataract surgery 10 days ago, I realize how yellowish
my vision had been. I have one normal eye and 1 yellow cast eye now. The
other to get fixed in June :)
So for us old farts, our eyes themselves can throw us off on colors.
However, I am interested in a "loaner" ibis. Where would I get one? At a
bank or credit union? LOL
David McDonald
friendswood texas
On Mon, May 8, 2017 at 6:43 PM, Clay Taylor <Clay.Taylor@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
All -
A caution. I am an old slide-shooter from Back In The Day, when
Kodachrome, Ektachrome, and Fujichrome images for the same bird had HUGELY
different color tones and white balances.
While I have absolutely no issue with the evaluation (below) of the
various colors present on the images in question, I am always VERY cautious
when absolutes are placed on color renditions of jpeg images (subject to
processing bias) viewed on purely random screens (laptop, computer monitor,
iPhone, etc.) that themselves have not been color calibrated. I have
given digital slide shows where I could look at the bird slide on my laptop
and the same image projected on the screen in front of the audience, and
those two birds were TOTALLY different in color tone, balance, and "look".
It is entirely possible that a person viewing that same ibis image on a
different monitor would completely disagree with the statement "no hint of
red in the 'ground color' of the face. It is essentially black".
I myself have a LOT of difficulty in separating reds from greens and
browns of the same intensity, which is why my field birding mostly relies
upon sound, detail, shape, proportion, and movement / action. I also
place a LOT of credence in behavior - a "loaner" ibis would definitely ping
my radar (birdar?) as being worth investigating.
Does a Glossy Ibis have a different "grunt" than a White-faced? Huh, I
do not know....
Clay Taylor
TOS Life Member
Calallen (Corpus Christi) TX
Clay.taylor@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
401-965-9064
-----Original Message-----
From: texbirds-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:texbirds-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]
On Behalf Of Mark and Brenda Steuer
Sent: Monday, May 8, 2017 3:43 PM
To: brushfreeman@xxxxxxxxx; Clay Taylor <Clay.Taylor@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Cc: FCollins@xxxxxxxx; dawgler@xxxxxxxxx; texbirds@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [texbirds] Re: Glossy/White-faced Ibis hybrid
Ibis at LaFitte's woods, Galveston. I observed the bird that was
photographed by David McDonald on May 6th, and I will reference the two
images David posted to Texbirds. A few points to note:
1) there is no hint of red in the 'ground color' of the face. It is
essentially black. See DM's 6902 jpeg. 2) the iris is dark brown (jpeg
6913), not red.3) the thin line below the black face is pale blue (jpeg
6902)4) bill color is ambiguous, generally gray with brownish tones on
basal upper mandible. Also noteworthy was the presence of two definitive
WFIB (a breeding plumaged adult with a 1st summer juvenile) at the time the
putative GLIB was present. Although all the Ibis moved through the day,
never did the always closely associated WFIB consort with the Glossy type.
The paper on separating these two species that was sent as a PDF by B.
Freeman is really useful. In fact, the type example of a GLIB in that paper
is a lay down for this bird. Also, a review of GLIB images posted by the
Smithsonian show many individuals closely resembling this bird. In short, I
don't believe that it is possible that this individual could be a WFIB.
That said, the bill color ambiguity cannot perhaps
rule out a possible GLIB X WFIB backcross, but without splitting hairs,
I'd say this bird is as good as any for a Glossy Ibis.
Sent from Yahoo Mail for iPhone
On Monday, May 8, 2017, 1:27 PM, Brush Freeman <brushfreeman@xxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
I was not there but was the Titmouse lady Claire Curry? She did a lot of
titmouse work mainly in N. Texas and SW. Okla.
On Mon, May 8, 2017 at 1:16 PM, Clay Taylor <Clay.Taylor@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
wrote:
All -or Black-crested.
I am convinced that our field observations / field marks leading to
the determination of "hybrid / not-hybrid" for a lot of species
(ibises, titmice, etc.) are nothing more than guesses.
At the TOS Meeting in El Paso, a woman (I cannot find her name right
now) gave a talk about hybridization amongst the titmice (Tufted and
Black-crested) and turned everything upside-down.
Her biggest bombshell was that genetic testing showed that, more often
than not, the titmice that "looked" like hybrids were actually most
often cleanly one species or the other, and that most of the birds
that actually WERE hybrids fit the visual cues for either "pure" Tufted
species.
That was when I swore off using the "H-word" for similar-appearing
I suspect that the dark ibises would show similar traits. Plus, I
have always been leery of using soft-body-part color as a reliable
indicator of anything - general health of a bird or diet can influence
colors of beaks, legs, facial skin, etc. I have a dandy photo of an
orange-billed and -legged Laughing Gull as proof of that.
Clay Taylor
TOS Life Member
Calallen (Corpus Christi) TX
Clay.taylor@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
401-965-9064
-----Original Message-----
From: texbirds-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:texbirds-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]
On Behalf Of Brush Freeman
Sent: Monday, May 8, 2017 12:59 PM
To: FCollins@xxxxxxxx
Cc: dawgler@xxxxxxxxx; texbirds@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [texbirds] Re: Glossy/White-faced Ibis hybrid
...
8Fred< In the paper I cited, you might look at some of the
hybrids....There are some Glossys I doubt I could define as hybrids
given the powder blue and all the other traits. Especially not from
afar. I don't know how some of these were determined to be hybrids,
but Donna said there was genetic testing done on similar
individuals.....I countered, tongue in cheek basically, then how can
we know that any of our GLIBs are "clean"
On Mon, May 8, 2017 at 12:18 PM, Collins, Fred (Commissioner Pct. 3) <
FCollins@xxxxxxxx> wrote:
I would agree with Joseph Kennedy on this bird and would call it afacebook site:
White-faced Ibis but know too it could possibly be a hybrid. But the
two ibis are usually not in high condition. Instead they are more
typically in fading breeding condition and hence not as clear cut as
I would feel comfortable identifying. People identify and post
pictures more often than not of birds that to me are not
distinguishable. I use the Plegadis option often on checklist.
Hybrids are rare and a non-breeder in less than healthy condition
might have its reds turn brown or gray. That is likely a common
occurrence. So the most likely case would be for the most likely ibis.
Generally if I am persistent this time of year I can find a Glossy
or two on the Katy Prairie if I can find many Ibis at all. They are
usually by themselves and usually in such good condition that their
identification is straight forward; pure blue face, blue legs with
perhaps reddish knees and a sharp thin bluish-whitish facial outline.
Fred Collins, Director
Kleb Woods Nature Center
20303 Draper Road, Tomball TX 77377
281-357-5324
Harris County Precinct 3
Steve Radack Commissioner
www.pct3.com
-----Original Message-----
From: texbirds-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:texbirds-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]
On Behalf Of Dennis Shepler
Sent: Monday, May 08, 2017 6:49 AM
To: texbirds@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [texbirds] Glossy/White-faced Ibis hybrid
Howdy Texbirders,
Glad the photo issues regarding the Plegadis Ibis at Lafitte's Cove
have been discussed and "resolved". Based on my observations and
photos, I believed that the bird in question is a hybrid
Glossy/White-faced Ibis. I wrote the following of the Real Texbird
"After hearing of the sighting of a Glossy Ibis at Lafitte's Cove, Iregarding the bird pictured here."
went down this morning to search for the Glossy. The only dark
(Pelagadis spp.) ibis I found that might fit the description of a
Glossy Ibis is shown in the following pictures. I think this bird is
a hybrid Glossy/White-faced. I would appreciate comments from the
community. The bird pictured has what appears to be a "reddish" (not
dark) iris, more gray than brown in the bill and reddish in the area
of the tibiotarsus-tarsometatarsus joint (the "ankle"). Light plays
an important role in these photos and others may have photos of the
"Glossy" seen that indicate that there was a pure Glossy Ibis
present at Lafitte's. Glossy Ibis is a rare bird on the Texas coast
and is known to hybridize with White-faced Ibis. Thanks for your
comments
Here is a link to photos that show, I think, the field marks
referenced in my statement:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/olddawgler/33687363244/in/dateposted-f
am
ily/
https://www.flickr.com/photos/olddawgler/34400133061/in/dateposted-f
am
ily/
https://www.flickr.com/photos/olddawgler/33687364574/in/dateposted-f
am
ily/
Comments welcome and you all have my permission to use the photos.
Dennis
West Houston
Harris County
--
W. Dennis Shepler
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