[SI-LIST] Re: Antwort: Re: Diff line
- From: "Beal, Weston" <weston_beal@xxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: silist <si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Fri, 15 Feb 2002 11:57:53 -0800
Pat,
I also have Brian Young's book and find it to be very useful. I'm pretty sure
Brian Young has a PhD degree, but he works on real design issues. His book is,
in my opinion, a very good balance of practical examples with the mathematics
to back it up. It's my first reference for most SI problems. Like Scott, I
also use Microwave Engineering by Pozar as my preferred high frequency
reference for the same reasons I like Digital Signal Integrity.
Later,
Weston
-----Original Message-----
From: Pat Diao [mailto:Pat_Diao@xxxxxxxx]
Sent: Friday, February 15, 2002 11:32 AM
To: 'scott@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx'; Andreas Lenkisch; silist
Subject: [SI-LIST] Re: Antwort: Re: Diff line
Hi Scott,
I'm interested to know more about your opinion on the book you mentioned:
Digital Signal Integrity, Brian Young
Checked at Amazon.com. the full name of the book is "Digital Signal
Integrity: Modeling and Simulation with Interconnects and Packages". It has
more than 500 pages.
I'd like to know:
1. Does it explain the basic concepts of SI issues in a CONCISE way? Or you
have to do through a lot of pages and texts to dig out the information?
2. Since it deals with "modeling and simulation", it scares me a little when
I thinks of the kind of books with a lot of flow charts and programs from a
specific software which are good at filling up hundreds of pages in a book
but mean very little to the readers. What's your comment on this book?
Anyone else's comments on this are also greatly appreciated.
Pat
Pat Diao
ASAT Inc.
Fremont, CA
phone: (510) 249-1227
cell: (408) 666-2285
pat_diao@xxxxxxxx
-----Original Message-----
From: Scott McMorrow [mailto:scott@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]
Sent: Friday, February 15, 2002 9:49 AM
To: Andreas Lenkisch; silist
Subject: [SI-LIST] Re: Antwort: Re: Diff line
Andreas,
Return loss arises from reflections. S11 is an indication of how much
reflected energy is returned in the system. Anything that causes
increased impedance mismatch, causes reflection and higher return loss.
I don't know any one book where all this information can be found. But
the following are my favorites:
Microwave Engineering, Pozar
Digital Signal Integrity, Brian Young
regards,
scott
Andreas Lenkisch wrote:
>Scott,
>
>from where the even mode return losses do arise?, may yoe recommend me some
>literature .
>
>regards
>Andreas
>
>Andreas Lenkisch
>Product Manager Backplanes
>Schroff GmbH
>Langenalber Strasse 96-100
>D-75334 Straubenhardt
>Germany
>Ph.: ++49 7082 794 674
>FAX.: ++49 7082 794 133
>mobile: ++49 175 59 43 544
>e-mail: andreas_lenkisch@xxxxxxxxxx
>Internet: www.schroff.de
>
>
>
>
>
> Scott McMorrow
> <scott@vasthorizo An:
zanella_fabrizio@xxxxxxx
> ns.com> Kopie:
"'pikeda@xxxxxxxxxxx'" <pikeda@xxxxxxxxxxx>,
> Gesendet von: si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> si-list-bounce@fr Thema: [SI-LIST] Re: Diff
line
> eelists.org
>
>
> 15.02.2002 04:16
> Bitte antworten
> an scott
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>All,
>
>Both loosely coupled and tightly coupled differential pair designs work
>as all authors have previously stated. The following is a list of some
>of the general differences between the two types of edge-coupled
>differential pairs:
>
>Loosely coupled
> better impedance control
> less sensitivity to manufacturing variations
> lower track density
> lower even mode return loss
> lower insertion loss
> less impedance variation at 2mm connector transitions
> less impedance variation at BGA escapes transitions
> less impedance variation at via transitions
>
>Tightly coupled
> worse impedance control
> greater sensitivity to manufacturing variations
> higher track density
> higher even mode return loss
> higher insertion loss
> greater impedance variation at 2mm connector transitions
> greater impedance variation at BGA escape transitions
> greater impedance variation at via transitions
>
>As with all things in interconnect engineering, there are tradeoffs. At
>3.125 Gbps and above, it's the impedance mismatches that get you into
>trouble, especially near connectors, vias and device escapes. It is
>extremely easy to create unwanted resonances which will cause unexpected
>losses at the strangest frequences, some easily within the frequency
>spectrum of data streams.
>
>For high speed circuits where trace density is not an issue, I always
>choose to use loosely coupled differential pair conductors, where
>impedance control is much more precise, and resonances caused by
>impedance mismatch can more easily be reduced.
>
>
>regards,
>
>scott
>
>
>--
>Scott McMorrow
>Principal Engineer
>SiQual Interconnect Engineering
>18735 SW Boones Ferry Road
>Tualatin, OR 97062-3090
>(503) 885-1231
>http://www.siqual.com
>
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