[SI-LIST] Re: AW: AW: Stripline reference
- From: Amit Kumar <Amit.Kumar@xxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: "Gert.Havermann@xxxxxxxxxxx" <Gert.Havermann@xxxxxxxxxxx>, "si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx" <si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Wed, 2 Oct 2013 05:08:50 +0000
Hello Gert/Experts,
The discussion on the stripline reference was really good. Thanks to everyone
for the contribution.
I have a differential pair routed on top and bottom layer(so both microstrip).
The top layer routing has a vdd plane as reference and the bottom routing has
gnd as reference.
I have two questions here:
1) Do you see a significant impact on performance because of different
reference plane on different layers.
2) How do we assign ports for this differential pair? Is it ok to assign one
side port with ground reference and other side with power reference?
Regards
Amit Kumar
Baghmane Tech park, Bengaluru
T: + 91-80-42422526
amit.kumar@xxxxxxxxxxx
-----Original Message-----
From: si-list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:si-list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
Behalf Of Havermann, Gert
Sent: Monday, September 30, 2013 1:31 PM
To: si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [SI-LIST] AW: AW: Stripline reference
Amit,
if power and GND have the same distance to the trace, then both will see
identical coupling and the return current that flows on the Planes will be
equal in both planes.
The Cap I mentioned is the coupling cap between Power and GND. The Return
current on the Power plane has to go back to the signal source. Since the Power
plane has no direct DC connection to GND, you have to establish a capacitive
coupling to allow the current to flow back to GND. The position of these caps
governs the "detour" you force the return current to flow. This means
additional inductance in your path, and a great source of crosstalk. Without
Coupling caps you will create lots of radiation as the currents will find their
way "over the air".
I hope this helps.
BR
Gert
----------------------------------------
Absender ist HARTING Electronics GmbH, Marienwerderstraße 3, D-32339 Espelkamp;
Registergericht: Amtsgericht Bad Oeynhausen; Register-Nr.: HRB 8808;
Vertretungsberechtige Geschäftsführer: Dipl.-Kfm. Edgar-Peter Düning,
Dipl.-Ing. Torsten Ratzmann
-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
Von: Amit Kumar [mailto:Amit.Kumar@xxxxxxxxxxx]
Gesendet: Freitag, 27. September 2013 13:20
An: Havermann, Gert; si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Betreff: RE: [SI-LIST] AW: Stripline reference
Hello Gert,
What if power and ground layers are equidistant from the signal layer?
Also, can you explain what do you mean by the position of the cap?
Regards
Amit Kumar
Baghmane Tech park, Bengaluru
T: + 91-80-42422526
amit.kumar@xxxxxxxxxxx
-----Original Message-----
From: si-list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:si-list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
Behalf Of Havermann, Gert
Sent: Friday, September 27, 2013 4:37 PM
To: si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [SI-LIST] AW: Stripline reference
It all depends on the position of Coupling caps, the distance to each plane and
the speed of your signal.
If you simulate, you have to take the position of the caps into account, or at
least leave the power plane floating at each port. The model must be as close
to reality as possible, thus only connections between planes that are really
there should be used in simulation. And the right boundary has to be used as it
has massive influence on the results.
BR
Gert
----------------------------------------
Absender ist HARTING Electronics GmbH, Marienwerderstraße 3, D-32339 Espelkamp;
Registergericht: Amtsgericht Bad Oeynhausen; Register-Nr.: HRB 8808;
Vertretungsberechtige Geschäftsführer: Dipl.-Kfm. Edgar-Peter Düning,
Dipl.-Ing. Torsten Ratzmann
-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
Von: si-list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:si-list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] Im
Auftrag von Jason wuc
Gesendet: Freitag, 27. September 2013 12:55
An: si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Betreff: [SI-LIST] Stripline reference
Hello Experts,
I need your help.
I am extracting s-parameter of some strupline traces. These traces connect two
flip chips on board and are routed between power and ground plane where power
is upper plane and ground is lower plane I am in doubt that whether I should
take ground/power as reference or both planes as reference while assigning
ports.
Please reply.
Jason
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