I agree.... it is terrible to lose a dog to bloat/torsion or for that matter ANY reason.... for the first 6 years I was in American show line GSD's I averaged one dog bloating a year.... I was able to save all but two of them but one that we lost was our first Champion.... and it hurt (ALOT) it still hurts 4 1/2 years later. I completely changed the bloodlines I had.... I didn't make accusations because it wouldn't have been fair to the other people who still have those bloodlines and have kept them until they died of old age at 13 and 14 years of age.... the breeders of those dogs have MANY old dogs of those bloodlines.... there are people on this list that have old dogs of those same lines... SO why did I change bloodlines????? It was because those dogs weren't working for me... maybe it was me.... probably it was me. When I changed bloodlines, MANY and I repeat MANY people told me I was going from the frying pan into the fire but that was nearly 5 years ago and I haven't had a single dog of those new lines bloat and/or torsion since I changed. I am sure other people have lost dogs of my bloodlines to bloat/torsion in the same time period but these dogs work for me. They fit my lifestyle. I couldn't be happier with them. It is just as I said... when I breed my bitch to a male..... if I have problems the first place I am going to look for the source is my BITCH... if it's not her it won't take long to find out....news of problems with a popular stud dog travels like wildfire. As for the BOSS.... I saw him show..... He was good.... but he's MADE me a fan, not by what he was a show dog, but by what he has produced..... GREAT dogs with FEW problems... just what we ALL say we want. I don't have any of his progeny but I'd love to have a nice bitch off him if someone is afraid of his genes.... (and I'll be glad to pay all expenses from anywhere you are... is tomorrow too soon) LOL Gary Lewis ============================================================================ POST is Copyrighted 2004. All material remains the property of the original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE PROSECUTED. For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx VISIT OUR WEBSITE - http://www.showgsd.org ============================================================================