I agree with the person(s) who said that behind every good producer is an excellent pedigree--sometimes the animals carrying "the good genes" do not "look so great" themselves. And when you're looking at the pedigree, look WAY back--not just 2 or 3 generations. See what is back there: it will help you understand why you came up with that poor shoulder, good temperament, fair hips, great pigment et al. . .It's all what the dog carries. SO WHAT if the dog/bitch isn't the most beautiful in the world? He/she may produce show quality or not, according to his/her genetic make-up. On the other hand, some gorgeous champions have produced nothing close to themselves. Maybe they were bred improperly--but maybe they just didn't carry "the good stuff." Phew! Happy Sunday and that's my sermon for the day! LOL Penny in NY ============================================================================ POST is Copyrighted 2006. All material remains the property of the original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE PROSECUTED. For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx VISIT OUR WEBSITE - URL temporarily deleted due to AOL issues ============================================================================