I visited Helen's kennel when I was doing my own and incorporated many of her ideas. My runs were 30 feet and I think I did 4 inches and if I were to do it over, I would have a little steeper pitch maybe 6 inches for 30 feet. So that might be 2 inches for every 10 feet that you are planning. The cement gutter that I put in was outside of the fencing for the dogs and was about a foot wide and about that deep as well. I had them taper the gutter to one end with about a six inch gradient from the high end to the low end so the liquid could drain out of the gutter and into a 2 foot diameter by 5 feet deep hole filled with large rocks in the bottom and river rocks on top so it would blend with the shrubs around it. I also had them create a "lip" on both sides of the gutter so that I could put cedar 2x4's in two foot panels so I could take them out and clean out the gutter --but otherwise the cedar was even with the sidewalk on the outside of the run Ginny Altman "Please let me be as kind, intelligent, and wonderful as my dog thinks I am." In a message dated 7/17/2008 6:49:21 P.M. Central Daylight Time, Showgsd-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxx writes: Subject: Re: Concrete kennel runs? In a message dated 7/17/2008 10:22:59 A.M. Central Daylight Time, BonJenShepherds@xxxxxxx writes: I am redoing most of my runs in concrete (all but 2 for youngsters). Anyway, what is the best pitch to put in the concrete for drainage? Also could those with concrete runs please let me in on anything I should know before diving into this big project. I had a 3 inch high cement curbing between each run,so no running water between runs . My slope from kennel exit opening into run down to the end of the 20 ft run was a four inch gradually drop. I had cement gutter at the end of all 12 runs I had the cement work done all at one time . The curbing enclosed the bottom of the posts and bottom of chain link fencing that separated the runs I had them finished with a slightly rough finish ,so no slipping and sliding. Very secure Lasted for 40 yrs,until I closed my kennel 8 yrs ago . Helen Miller Fisher **************Get fantasy football with free live scoring. Sign up for FanHouse Fantasy Football today. (http://www.fanhouse.com/fantasyaffair?ncid=aolspr00050000000020) ============================================================================ POST is Copyrighted 2007. All material remains the property of the original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE PROSECUTED. For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx VISIT OUR WEBSITE - www.showgsd.org ============================================================================