Thanks for all that info and feedback about your experiences. I think this year VS 2010 support will just get better under all the screen readers. If I was in charge of what to focus on for new versions of some screen reader I would firstly focus on MS development tools, not just because a large portion of my clients want to use those dev tools, but because they in themselves represent the forefront of UI technology isn't it?
On 2/15/2011 2:55 PM, RicksPlace wrote:
Hi Back: WindowEyes, like the other screenreaders, must cope with all new accessibility internals that allow for them to work with Visual Studio as well as other applications. The new hooks for Microsoft are called UI Accessibility and replace the MSAA hooks that Visual Studio 2003 through Visual Studio 2008. All the other Microsoft applications are also switching, or have already switched, to the new UI Accessibility format for the underlying accessibility hooks that the Screen Reader Companies must use to create voice output for Windows Applications like Sql Server, Office Products and other products. JAWS started using the new technologies around the middle of last year while WindowEyes is just coming out with their new UI Accessibility driven Screen Reader version. That said, I found WindowEyes much prefferable to JAWS when working in the various Microsoft products. It just worked better in my opinion although about 90 percent of the programmers on list work with JAWS. WindowEyes is now in beta testing of the new release and I have not tested it with VS 2010 yet so can't really comment on it. Again, that said, WindowEyes explicitly talked about the new version working with Visual studio in an earlier e-mail press release and demonstrated it to some extent. The current state of the JAWS scripts is up in the air. There was some talk on list about upgrading the JAWS scripts to work with Visual Studio 2010 but I have not heard anything about any progress being made on that front. There were a couple of folks who were talking about developing a plug-in to work with Visual Studio which could be a very powerful approach but would not work with any of the free Express Modules offered by Microsoft. I have not heard anything about this project either so it is also up in the air. WindowEyes has an extremely powerful Scripting Language and when they update it to include the UI Automation technicals it will, again my opinion, offer the most comprehensive scripting capabilities if WindowEyes continues to use their COM interface technique that allows for almost complete access to DOM technicals for Visual Studio and any other Microsoft products. For now I am not working with Visual Studio 2010 and won't start working with it until the WindowEyes scripting language is updated later this year - at least that is my timeline guess. Using WindowEyes I found Visual Studio and Sql Server, the Express modules of VWD, VB.net and Sql server and Sql server CE quite accessible and expect that Visual Studio and all the Express modules will be even more accessible with the new WindowEyes. That's all I have on this subject until I start working with Visual Studio 2010 some time in the near future. Perhaps I will install Windows7 prior to starting with that new group of technologies. They are quite different in some ways than the prior versions of Visual Studio since they are based on a new technology called WPF which requires UI Accessibility to work with a screen reader properly. So, if you are starting to work in VS 2010 try the JAWS approach for now and ask for help from some of the JAWS users on list to get started. When WindowEyes is fully working with UIA and I decide to pull the trigger on a new Visual Studio environment I will post up some step by step articles.Rick USA. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Kerneels Roos" <kerneels@xxxxxxxxx> To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Tuesday, February 15, 2011 7:30 AM Subject: Re: VS 2010 againHi Rick,How well does Windows Eyes cope with VS 2010 in general and compared to JAWS?Thanks, Kerneels On 2/15/2011 1:01 PM, RicksPlace wrote:Hi: I am not sure aboutVS 2010 but that is not an option in all other versions of Visual Studio. There are several things you can do to reduce or eliminate the problem of that Error Window grabbing focus while you try and type. Now, you will find that there are a couple of settings under the Tools>Options Treeview that will help quite a bit. That said, if you run a test or call up the error window manually, you might start getting it poping up again when you don't want it. In other words, you can code your code, then bring up the error window from under the View Menu or by using a hot key, if you have one. After you test your program you might have to close Visual Studio and ReOpen it again to make the problem go away. I don't use JAWS but JAWS has a hot key that does something with that window that was programmed into the JAWS Scripts in the past but may, or not, be non-functional in the VS 2010 version of JAWS. I forget the settings under the Tools>Optiions TreeView but there are documents on how to set up Visual Studio for accessibility and that problem is addressed in those documents. So, the key is to set up Visual Studio properly for Accessibility using one of the documents available on the subject, set up JAWS, if it still works in VS 2010, to handle that window and then to do your coding before you test. You may, or not, have to close and ReOpen your project after a test if the Error Window becomes a problem. That's all I have on Visual Studio 2010, JAWS and Accessibility. I use WindowEyes and so am not familiar with the work-arounds for JAWS - sorry. Note that there are some folks who are building a plug-in set of accessibility tools for Visual Studio, or at least they were doing that a couple of months ago. Also, I think someone was looking at upgrading the JAWS Scripts to work with VS 2010 but I don't recall who was working on either project - again I use WindowEyes so don't follow those threads overly closely.Later and post up your solution when done so others can profit from it. Rick USA ----- Original Message ----- From: "Gomal Tao" <gomal.tao@xxxxxxxxx> To: <programmingblind@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Tuesday, February 15, 2011 4:52 AM Subject: RE: VS 2010 againI could not find any options to disable the automatic syntax checker undertools/options. /GabrielHelloI am using Visual Studio 2010 on daily basis. With the latest version of Jaws 12 it is possible to do most development in VS 2010. However, thereare a couple of concerns I would like to be able to address. [snip]2. When I write code in the code editor Visual Studio intervenes all thetime. The error windows steals focus all the time.I understand VS 2010 has among its vast array of features, a syntax checker that is by default active. I'm waiting for the final release of window-eyes 7.5 before i testdrive VS 2010 myself. Best John __________ View the list's information and change your settings at //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind __________ View the list's information and change your settings at //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind__________View the list's information and change your settings at //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind-- Kerneels Roos Cell: +27 (0)82 309 1998 Skype: cornelis.roos"There are only two kinds of programming languages in the world; those everyone complains about, and those nobody uses."__________View the list's information and change your settings at //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind__________View the list's information and change your settings at //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
-- Kerneels Roos Cell: +27 (0)82 309 1998 Skype: cornelis.roos "There are only two kinds of programming languages in the world; those everyone complains about, and those nobody uses." __________View the list's information and change your settings at //www.freelists.org/list/programmingblind
