[lit-ideas] For Paul (long)
- From: "Andy Amago" <aamago@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: "lit-ideas" <lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2006 22:20:40 -0400
You asked what's going on over there in the M.E. In a real nutshell, when
Israel was created in 1948, it was created on the homeland of the Palestinians.
The Palestinians were thrown off their land and the Israelis say the British
and the U.N. gave them the land. The Palestinians were not asked for their
opinion in being thrown off their land, they were just thrown off. They began
an insurgency, as it were, against the occupying Israelis. The U.S. supports
Israel, the Palestinians are supported by the now Palestinian Authority and by
Hamas and Hezbollah, basically grassroots movements for Palestinian rights. We
of course categorize Hezbollah and Hamas as terrorists, the way corporations
saw Unions in the early twentieth century in this country. Hezbollah was
formed in 1982 in response to the Israeli invasion of Lebanon.
The Israelis counter that the Arabs are at fault because they don't take the
Palestinians in. The Israelis have blockaded the Palestinians economically and
with food and water. They've steamrolled their houses and basically treated
them brutally while mocking them for not having the same arms as the Israelis
(you yourself said it). The Palestinian refugees have used terror tactics in
response; hence, they're terrorists. The last 60 years have been spent in
creating two states.
The Jews are not entirely to blame in the sense that they were thrown out of
Europe and horrendously persecuted for just about all of European history.
They needed a homeland, and ironically chose the land on which their fellow
Semites had lived peacefully alongside them for millennia. Complicating things
now is the End Times thing where Christians support Israel because the Bible
says the coming of Israel portends Armageddon. It?s a self-fulfilling prophecy
if ever there was one.
Iraq has nothing to do with the Palestinians at all. Iraq was/is composed of
the Shiites, Sunnis and Kurds. The Sunnis were the Bath party, Saddam's party.
The Shiites (concentrated in Iran) were the opposition to Saddam; we supported
the Shiites. Even though they were the majority in Iraq they were dominated by
the minority Sunnis, but Saddam was completely secular. He patterned himself
after Stalin. Iran hated Saddam and the Sunnis (OBL is a Sunni). Iran tried
to get Saddam out for 8 years and failed. We did it for them in three weeks
but then we let the insurgency happen, aided and abetted it in fact, disbanded
the Iraqi army, which is to say, Sunni army, effectively turning loose
something like 50,000 disenfranchised men onto the streets to stir trouble,
humiliated the people generally and did everything wrong that could possibly be
done wrong.
OBL originated al Qaeda, which started as the mujahadeen in Afghanistan
fighting the Soviets. We basically helped al Qaeda fight our enemy, the SU; we
armed them to fight in the caves of Afghanistan. OBL was persona non gratis
among the Taliban. He originally began in Ethiopia or Sudan and moved his
camps to Afghanistan when he was bombed by Clinton in that factory. I forget
why the Taliban accepted him (political bedfellows); I think they're more
allied with Pakistan. They are truly a bunch of wackos, a bunch of criminals
with no political agenda, unlike Hamas and Hezbollah. They are the Wahabbis
that Lawrence talks about (correct me here Lawrence). Their only 'agenda' is
to bring down the U.S. OBL?s relatives of course run Saudi Arabia but that's
probably neither here nor there. Iran is opposed to al Qaeda and offered their
aid to Bush in tracking them down after 9/11. Naturally, Bush refused. The
Iranian revolution initially was against the U.S. imposed Shah, an
other brutal tyrant. Al Qaeda moved right into the vacuum in Iraq and stirred
the pot more and more, recruited for their cause. Al Qaeda is now
decentralized and everywhere. OBL is just a figurehead. Even the FBI/CIA have
basically stopped searching for him.
Islam in much of the world is turned to by the people as a reaction against the
corruption and ineffectiveness of the governments, many of them pro-Western.
Governments of Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Egypt are friendly to the U.S. although
now are running scared because of Hezbollah. Hezbollah has morphed into a
political party in Lebanon with a lot of popular support. The more Israelis
act like aggressors, the more popular Hezbollah are becoming.
For Lawrence, eliminating radicals by exterminating them is like trying to
exterminate dust. It?s funny that when pressed for specifics, you always come
back with some generality, which of course is natural since it?s impossible to
get rid of radicals through violence, especially since we're maxed out in Iraq.
It?s like you go to a store and someone wants you to pay for your goods and
you respond by giving them ideology.
For Paul, regarding what to do, read Tom Ricks and Ron Susskind. That?s a
place to start. Basically, though, we're fucked in Iraq. There?s no way out.
If we had any brains we'd be talking nice to Iran and making peace big time
instead of rallying the few who are left against us. But then again, who said
we had any brains?
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