[jawsscripts] Re: jawsscripts Digest V6 #130
- From: Paul Bonarrigo <pjbonarrigo@xxxxxxxxx>
- To: "jawsscripts@xxxxxxxxxxxxx" <jawsscripts@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2012 11:10:01 -0700 (PDT)
Re: Logos Bible
I know nothing of the application but it suspiciously smells like a Java app.
PC and Jaws cursor not speaking.
If it is a Java app, try installing Oracle/Sun's Java Access Bridge.
If it's not, pardon me.
________________________________
From: FreeLists Mailing List Manager <ecartis@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: jawsscripts digest users <ecartis@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Sunday, June 17, 2012 10:08 PM
Subject: jawsscripts Digest V6 #130
jawsscripts Digest Sun, 17 Jun 2012 Volume: 06 Issue: 130
In This Issue:
[jawsscripts] Re: A last-gasp attempt at this 3270 problem o
[jawsscripts] Can Logos 4 be scripted?
[jawsscripts] Re: Can Logos 4 be scripted?
[jawsscripts] Re: Can Logos 4 be scripted?
[jawsscripts] Re: Can Logos 4 be scripted?
[jawsscripts] Re: Can Logos 4 be scripted?
[jawsscripts] Re: Can Logos 4 be scripted?
----------------------------------------------------------------------
From: "Geoff Chapman" <gch@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [jawsscripts] Re: A last-gasp attempt at this 3270 problem of mine
Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2012 02:58:28 +1000
grrr! That is all bad news.
So no job created for the potential blind employee then. One is tempted to
ask who makes these executive money decisions in your country, but, we'd be
straying from list topics so I won't ask.
Thanks for code reception acknowledgement.
Geoff c.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Matzura" <number6@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <jawsscripts@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Saturday, June 16, 2012 9:48 AM
Subject: [jawsscripts] Re: A last-gasp attempt at this 3270 problem of mine
> Unfortunately, Jeff et al., it's all true. It was like pulling teeth
> for me to get the hours paid for that I did spend, and, since they'll
> be ripping the whole thing out before the end of the year and
> replacing it with (hopefully) something better, everybody deemed the
> whole thing not worth doing but revisiting it after the new software,
> whatever it is, is put in place. No jobs were created, I'm sorry to
> say. And yes, I *did* say something could be done to improve access,
> but it wasn't going to happen overnight, not to mention overweek. I
> thank you for the ideas and code, though, which I shall keep in the
> event I run into something like this again.
>
>
> On Fri, 15 Jun 2012 15:24:25 +1000, you wrote:
>
>>So but Steve, are you saying this is kind of a done deal now? and that you
>>can no longer access the system to work on it for this potential employee?
>>Does this mean the person is just not gunna get the job though? not
>>because
>>it can't be done, but because it can't be done in one day?
>>Far out though! That just seems all wrong to me!
>>What about the jolly blind employee!
>>
>>In case you can submit a report indicating that it can be actually done,
>>and
>>encourage your bean counters to spill forth with the funds in order to
>>permit this employee a useable and eficient playing field, if given
>>sufficient time to put it together, then here is the adendum to my post I
>>promised you yesterday, complete with code fragments which might help.
>>
>>Ok so I'll just try and explain a bit of this before pasting.
>>
>>The first function, VirtualizePriorityInfoCustomerHistoryNarrative, is
>>just
>>a simple example of the method I used to grab data from various custom
>>defined rectangles on the screen, without first defining them as frames,
>>and
>>adding them to the userBuffer, along with manually inserted text String
>>labels for each one, then immediately virtualizing that info for user to
>>traverse.
>>Of course I'd done the checking as to whether I was on the correct screen,
>>previously, firstly using NewTextEvent, to watch for a whole range of
>>possible screen identifiers that I'd found denoted each screen, then
>>scheduling little ScreenCheck functions if it saw that text come in, to
>>then
>>check if that text was in it's expected place on given screens. Then
>>based
>>on that outcome I'd set a giWhichScreen Global integer variable, to a
>>certain number.
>>Then, Although I know seasoned scripters warn to be jolly careful not to
>>clutter up both NewTextEvent and KeyPressedEvent, because of just how
>>often
>>the jolly things run, and I totally understood that,
>>i ended up utilizing KeyPressedEvent pretty extensively, and I've had no
>>complaints from the employees using it, in jaws8, on machines 5 years old
>>now in performance,
>>To enable me to do exactly what you were wanting to do. I.e. use the same
>>set of control+GraveAccent through Number keys, to grab different data/do
>>different things, on their relevant screens etc.
>>
>>I'll paste in a rather lengthy yet fairly repetitious fragment of my
>>KeyPressedEvent usage, just to show how it ended up working, along with
>>fairly extensive commentary.
>>I hope it may help.
>>
>>in basic form, in case you don't reeeeally need to read the code to get
>>the
>>jist,
>>the logic of the KeyPressedEvent usage was,
>>First run a SaveKeyHistory Function at the front end,
>>(Which facilitates some necessary usage of an overRiding IsSameScript
>>function, the necessity of which escapes me for the moment,)
>>then,
>>if I'm on screen1, Blah Blah screen, then,
>> if nKey is Blah, then,
>>if KeyboardHelp is enabled, then,
>>if IsSameScript DoublePressed in Keyboard help then,
>> run the doublePress code,
>>else Single Press Keyboard Help for that key.
>>EndIf Keyboard Help active check,
>>then
>>run the function to grab the relevant data you wanna either hear, or
>>virtualize, for that key, on that particular screen.
>>
>>Oh By the way, in case anyone is wondering, I didn't come up with this
>>cool
>>logic/idea myself.
>>but it worked a treat for me, and x years out the people are still using
>>it
>>successfully under jaws 8.
>>
>>ok here we go then. code time.
>>
>>The kind of code I used, to grab things from the screen and shove them
>>into
>>the UserBuffer, with manual field labels alongside each bit of data,
>>looked
>>something like this:
>>
>>Function VirtualizePriorityInfoCustomerHistoryNarrative () ; assigned to
>>control+GraveAccent on Customer History Narrative Screen
>>
>>; immediately Virtualizes the 5 most relevant components, Order date,
>>narrative record type code, description, UserID, and LastChangedTime, from
>>customer history narrative screen.
>>
>>; as opposed to speaking them on a singleKeyPress and virtualizing them
>>upon
>>a doublePress, because will always be too much info to take in, in one
>>announcement shot.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>var
>>
>>string sOrderDate,
>>
>>String sNarrativeRecordTypeCode,
>>
>>String sDescription,
>>
>>String sUserID,
>>
>>string sLastChangedTime
>>
>>
>>
>>; let user no i'ts virtualizing on a single keyPress.
>>
>>SayUsingVoice (VCTX_JAWSCURSOR, "virtual", OT_String)
>>
>>
>>
>>; first check userBuffer isn't already active and give time to dismiss for
>>screen to settle if so. Delay is long but it had to be for stability in
>>this
>>setup.
>>
>>
>>
>>If UserBufferIsActive () then
>>
>>UserBufferDeactivate ()
>>
>>UserBufferClear ()
>>
>>SayUsingVoice (VCTX_JAWSCURSOR, "Please wait", Ot_String)
>>
>>Delay (6)
>>
>>EndIf ; is UserBuffer Active check
>>
>>; now populate the variables with the data info we want, using
>>GetTextInRect
>>functions instead of GetTextInFrames, coz I found it easier in the end.
>>
>>; also precede each line with it's field label manually, inserting space
>>before closing quote after the colon, for nicer reading, plus ability to
>>controlRightArrow to the data if needs to step through char by char.
>>
>>let sLastChangedTime = GetTextInRect (861, 561, 921, 584)
>>
>>let sNarrativeRecordTypeCode = GetTextInRect (369, 197, 873, 220)
>>
>>let sDescription = GetTextInRect (369, 223, 969, 246)
>>
>>let sUserID = GetTextInRect (369, 249, 489, 272)
>>
>>let sOrderDate = GetTextInRect (369, 171, 489, 194)
>>
>>
>>
>>; now compile the userBuffer and virtualize info
>>
>>UserBufferDeactivate ()
>>
>>UserBufferClear ()
>>
>>UserBufferAddText ("LastChangedTime: " + sLastChangedTime)
>>
>>UserBufferAddText ("NarrativeRecordType: " + sNarrativeRecordTypeCode)
>>
>>UserBufferAddText ("Description: " + sDescription)
>>
>>UserBufferAddText ("UserID: " + sUserID)
>>
>>UserBufferAddText ("Date: " + sOrderDate)
>>
>>UserBufferActivate ()
>>
>>JawsTopOfFile ()
>>
>>SayLine ()
>>
>>EndFunction
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>And before demonstrating usage of KeyPressedEvent, here's the bits of
>>supporting code that were in place for it to work.
>>
>>void function SaveKeyHistory (string keyName)
>>; call this function from the first line of KeyPressedEvent
>>;SayString ("beep")
>>Let strPreviousKey = strLastKey
>>Let strLastKey = keyname
>>ScheduleFunction ("KeyboardTimeout", 5)
>>EndFunction
>>
>>Void Function KeyboardTimeOut ()
>>Let strLastKey = ""
>>;Pause ()
>>Let strPreviousKey = "..."
>>EndFunction
>>
>>Int Function IsSameScript ()
>>if (strLastKey == strPreviousKey) then
>> return(1)
>>else
>> return(0)
>>EndIf
>>EndFunction
>>
>> Function KeyPressedEvent (int nKey, string strKeyName, int nIsBrailleKey,
>>int nIsScriptKey)
>>; to learn what the NKey Variable integers are as I press them
>>; SayInteger (NKey)
>>
>>/*
>> as an alternative to swapping jkm files in and out of memory to alter the
>>behaviour of certain keys dependent on screen context,
>> as is currently being done with frame files for the same purpose,
>> I'm going to experiment with using KeyPressedEvent logic to handle this,
>> to
>>see which gives better endUser results/performance.
>> so either this code, or swapping jkm code, should be left active, but not
>>both.
>> test code to see whether KeyPressedEvent logic will be best to handle
>>varying reading jobs on various screens.
>> ok. this first line is placed here to enable a special SaveKey History
>>function to record each key being pressed,
>> to enable implementation of a special IsSameScript function overriding
>> the
>>builtIn,
>> which facilitates the same keys being assigned diferent functions on
>>different screens,
>> to hopefully make things simpler for the user who may wish to just grab
>> the
>>most useful information from a group of say 5 sameKey keystrokes,
>> rather than having to remember a bunch of keystrokes across several
>> screens
>>which in many cases may be glancing at very similar data in each case.
>>*/
>>; this is the function which acts as a kind of scrolling buffer of keys,
>>which facilitates the IsSameScript emulation in KeyPressedEvent multiple
>>key
>>screen Assignment idea.
>>SaveKeyHistory (strKeyName)
>>
>>if giWhichScreen == 1 then ; ScreenCheck1 Login/Entry screen
>>if NKey == 297 then ; Control+` on Main Menu/Login screen
>>if gbKeyboardHelp then
>>if IsSameScript () then ; double press
>>SayString (GetScriptDescription ("ManualReadMainMenuEntryScreen"))
>>else ; single press
>>SayString (GetScriptSynopsis ("ManualReadMainMenuEntryScreen"))
>>EndIf ; doublePress IsSameScript check
>>Return ; done speaking hotkey help
>>EndIf ; keyboard Help on check.
>>
>>; now run function attached to control+GraveAccent on Main Menu/Login
>>Screen
>>ManualReadMainMenuEntryScreen ()
>>Endif ; 2, end of keys for screen1.
>>
>>; nothing needed for screen 2 at this point
>>
>>elif giWhichScreen == 3 ; Enquiry readOnly screen
>>|| GiWhichScreen == 20 then ; Edit master enquiry screen
>>; ScreenCheck 3 for Advanced customer master enquiryReadOnlyScreen plus
>>screen 20 also.
>>
>>if NKey == 258 then ; Control+1
>>if gbKeyboardHelp then
>>if IsSameScript () then ; double press
>>SayString (GetScriptDescription
>>("CustomerNameReadReviewMasterInquiryReadOnly"))
>>else ; single press
>>SayString (GetScriptSynopsis
>>("CustomerNameReadReviewMasterInquiryReadOnly"))
>>EndIf ; doublePress IsSameScript check
>>Return ; done speaking hotkey help
>>EndIf ; keyboard Help on check.
>>; now run function attached to control+1 on Master Inquiry screen
>>CustomerNameReadReviewMasterInquiryReadOnly ()
>>; That just reads if singlePressed, Virtualizes if DoublePressed.
>>
>>elif NKey == 259 then ; Control+2
>>if gbKeyboardHelp then
>>if IsSameScript () then ; double press
>>SayString (GetScriptDescription
>>("CustomerAddressReadReviewMasterInquiryReadOnly"))
>>else ; single press
>>SayString (GetScriptSynopsis
>>("CustomerAddressReadReviewMasterInquiryReadOnly"))
>>EndIf ; IsSameScript doublePress check
>>Return ; done speaking hotkey help
>>EndIf ; keyboard Help on check.
>>; now run function attached to Control+2 on Master Inquiry screen
>>CustomerAddressReadReviewMasterInquiryReadOnly ()
>>
>>elIf NKey == 260 then ; Control+3
>>if gbKeyboardHelp then
>>if IsSameScript () then ; double press
>>SayString (GetScriptDescription
>>("CommentsReadReviewMasterInquiryReadOnly"))
>>else ; single press
>>SayString (GetScriptSynopsis ("CommentsReadReviewMasterInquiryReadOnly"))
>>EndIf ; IsSameScript check
>>Return ; done speaking hotkey help
>>EndIf ; keyboard Help on check.
>>; now run function attached to Control+3 on Master Inquiry screen
>>CommentsReadReviewMasterInquiryReadOnly ()
>>
>>elIf NKey == 261 then ; Control+4
>>if gbKeyboardHelp then
>>if IsSameScript () then ; double press
>>SayString (GetScriptDescription
>>("InstructionsReadReviewMasterInquiryReadOnly"))
>>else ; single press
>>SayString (GetScriptSynopsis
>>("InstructionsReadReviewMasterInquiryReadOnly"))
>>EndIf ; IsSameScript check
>>Return ; done speaking hotkey help
>>EndIf ; keyboard Help on check.
>>; now run function attached to Control+4 on Master Inquiry screen
>>InstructionsReadReviewMasterInquiryReadOnly ()
>>
>>elIf NKey == 262 then ; Control+5
>>if gbKeyboardHelp then
>>if IsSameScript () then ; double press
>>SayString (GetScriptDescription
>>("LastOrderReadReviewMasterInquiryReadOnly"))
>>else ; single press
>>SayString (GetScriptSynopsis ("LastOrderReadReviewMasterInquiryReadOnly"))
>>EndIf ; IsSameScript check
>>Return ; done speaking hotkey help
>>EndIf ; keyboard Help on check.
>>; now run function attached to Control+4 on Master Inquiry screen
>>LastOrderReadReviewMasterInquiryReadOnly ()
>>
>>elIf NKey == 297 then ; Control+GraveAccent on master Inquiry screen
>>if gbKeyboardHelp then
>>if IsSameScript () then ; double press
>>SayString (GetScriptDescription
>>("InstructionsReadReviewMasterInquiryReadOnly"))
>>else ; single press
>>SayString (GetScriptSynopsis
>>("InstructionsReadReviewMasterInquiryReadOnly"))
>>EndIf ; IsSameScript check
>>Return ; done speaking hotkey help
>>EndIf ; keyboard Help on check.
>>; now run function attached to Control+GraveAccent on Master Inquiry
>>screen
>>PerFormScript ReorderAdvancedCustomerMasterInquiryScreen ()
>>
>>
>>; ...
>>
>>Etc etc.
>>***
>>
>>
>>
>>----- Original Message -----
>>From: "Steve Matzura" <number6@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>To: <jawsscripts@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>Sent: Friday, June 15, 2012 12:35 AM
>>Subject: [jawsscripts] Re: A last-gasp attempt at this 3270 problem of
>>mine
>>
>>
>>> That was going to be another approach. I have also learned that the
>>> budget measured in both time and money for this project is severely
>>> limited, and they were hoping to have the potential employee start
>>> next week! This would take me at least a week to figure out, develop,
>>> implement, and train the user with it, and then, possibly less than a
>>> year from now, it would all go down the dumper when the company gets
>>> offa this 3270 nonsense. I wish I had the time to do this up right.
>>> You all have been immensely helpful with suggestions.
>>>
>>> On Tue, 12 Jun 2012 17:15:36 -0700 (PDT), you wrote:
>>>
>>>>Steve,
>>>>Â
>>>>Have you considered using Hotspot Clicker? You can control and load any
>>>>number of key definition files you might need and then be able to reuse
>>>>key assignments that are the same or similar. Just a thought.
>>>>Â
>>>>Tom
>>>>
>>>>________________________________
>>>> From: Steve Matzura <number6@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>>To: jawsscripts <jawsscripts@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
>>>>Sent: Tuesday, June 12, 2012 6:34 AM
>>>>Subject: [jawsscripts] A last-gasp attempt at this 3270 problem of mine
>>>>
>>>>Yesterday I spent a very productive three hours framing, labeling,
>>>>testing, triggering, and documenting a very busy screen on a
>>>>3270-emulation-based application. This thing was dancing on the
>>>>ceiling by the time I was finished with that screen. You could
>>>>hot-key-read any one of 35 fields on the screen, with or without field
>>>>names, which meant that I had to define two windows for each and every
>>>>field, and just in case you wanted to modify any of those fields, you
>>>>got a complimentary left-mouse-button click on that area of the screen
>>>>which would force the PC Cursor to that location so you could type
>>>>something in if so desired or if that area of the screen were even
>>>>designated as a field in the 3270 window definition back on the
>>>>application's home-base computer. Really neat stuff!
>>>>
>>>>Then, the second part of my day came crashing in. A summary screen
>>>>consisting of eleven lines of what amounted to a history view of
>>>>account activity in reverse chronological order, displayed in a
>>>>spreadsheet type layout, which needed to be broken up into its
>>>>individual fields, of which there were six per line, and searchable
>>>>and/or filterable by certain criteria within the data, such as show
>>>>only payments, show only bills, show only meter readings, etc.
>>>>Ideally, this should be available from the application itself, but it
>>>>isn't. If JAWS had the capability to define frames within frames, and
>>>>I don't mean just define another separate frame that just so happens
>>>>to be a sub-area of another frame, or if the ability existed to load a
>>>>separate set of frames and hot-key triggers for different screens all
>>>>with the same window name or control ID, I'd be set! Anybody remember
>>>>old JFD and how you could do stuf like that back then? I was also
>>>>thinking of trying to write a script which could navigate these eleven
>>>>lines of data and read only those lines where certain information was
>>>>displayed, like the code or text to indicate a payment, for example,
>>>>so the end-user could press a key and have the eleven lines filtered
>>>>the way they needed, but I couldn't for the life of me figure a way to
>>>>do this and get it coded in an hour or two! Frames are great things,
>>>>but they're not smart in any way, shape or form. You can't tell a
>>>>frame "read this if you contain certain data, keep silent otherwise."
>>>>At least, I don't *think* you can. The only possible way I could think
>>>>of to do this was if the information was color-coded in some way, but
>>>>it isn't. Everything on the screen is the same color except the
>>>>modifiable fields, of which there turned out not to be all that many.
>>>>
>>>>And I haven't even gotten to tell you about another data select screen
>>>>where you put a selection mark in front of a summary line, hit a
>>>>function key, and get one of half a dozen selectable new screens with
>>>>detailed information on the summary item you selected! An incredible
>>>>amount of data is available through this system. I've been in the
>>>>data-mining industry for years, but not since I worked on stuff for
>>>>the securities industry have I seen stuff like I saw yesterday. And
>>>>they want the customer rep who operates this thing to have access to
>>>>it all so that customers can check on any aspect of their account with
>>>>this company. The customer service industry has come a long way. The
>>>>reports this system produces must be real eye-openers!
>>>>
>>>>... but I digress ...
>>>>
>>>>Then there's the question of just how many key combinations can one
>>>>person be expected to remember for one little old application if I
>>>>were to define frames for every single field on every single screen,
>>>>most of which wouldn't even make sense to be used as such, not to
>>>>mention I'd run outa keys before I ran outa fields!
>>>>
>>>>It was for this reason that I have prepared a report, not yet
>>>>submitted, that states that scripting for this application will not go
>>>>far enough to satisfy the access requirements of a JAWS user to work
>>>>with it and get the job done for which the application was originally
>>>>written in any kind of efficient manner. However, before I submit this
>>>>report, I thought I'd throw it out to you all for one last-gasp effort
>>>>to see if there's anything I haven't tried that I should, etc. Your
>>>>input greatly sought and appreciated.
>>>>
>>>>__________�
>>>>
>>>>View the list's information and change your settings at
>>>>//www.freelists.org/list/jawsscripts
>>>>__________�
>>>>
>>>>View the list's information and change your settings at
>>>>//www.freelists.org/list/jawsscripts
>>>>
>>> __________�
>>>
>>> View the list's information and change your settings at
>>> //www.freelists.org/list/jawsscripts
>>>
>>
>>__________�
>>
>>View the list's information and change your settings at
>>//www.freelists.org/list/jawsscripts
>>
> __________�
>
> View the list's information and change your settings at
> //www.freelists.org/list/jawsscripts
>
------------------------------
From: "John Thomas" <johnt@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [jawsscripts] Can Logos 4 be scripted?
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2012 17:07:49 -0400
Hi
A few years ago I wrote a set of scripts for version 3 of the Logos Bible
software program. A couple months after I finished, the Logos folks rolled
out version 4. It is built on a totally different platform. My evaluation of
version 4 is that it cannot be scripted. I just want to check my assumptions
with the list here to see if my assessment is correct.
I assume it cannot be scripted, because I cannot read any text with either
the JAWS or Invisible cursor. The only thing I can read is the name of the
program with the PC cursor. The cursor routing functions also do not work.
With the previous version, I could use the invisible cursor to read any text
that was visible to a sighted user. Since I cannot read anything with the
JAWS or Invisible cursors, I assume there is really nothing I can do with
version 4. Is this correct?
Thanks,
John
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2012 18:39:03 -0400
From: Doug Lee <doug.lee@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [jawsscripts] Re: Can Logos 4 be scripted?
If you're at all handy with Script Utility Mode, check out the window
class name of the main window, whether it has descendants, and whether
it has MSAA objects. If you have just a single window, no MSAA
objects, and no OSM text (which is what you already discovered), you
found a difficult case, and something like Hot Spot Clicker may be
your best bet. If you see a window tree and/or a set of MSAA objects,
it might be possible to script that.
On Sun, Jun 17, 2012 at 05:07:49PM -0400, John Thomas wrote:
Hi
A few years ago I wrote a set of scripts for version 3 of the Logos Bible
software program. A couple months after I finished, the Logos folks rolled
out version 4. It is built on a totally different platform. My evaluation of
version 4 is that it cannot be scripted. I just want to check my assumptions
with the list here to see if my assessment is correct.
I assume it cannot be scripted, because I cannot read any text with either
the JAWS or Invisible cursor. The only thing I can read is the name of the
program with the PC cursor. The cursor routing functions also do not work.
With the previous version, I could use the invisible cursor to read any text
that was visible to a sighted user. Since I cannot read anything with the
JAWS or Invisible cursors, I assume there is really nothing I can do with
version 4. Is this correct?
Thanks,
John
__________???
View the list's information and change your settings at
//www.freelists.org/list/jawsscripts
--
Doug Lee, Senior Accessibility Programmer
SSB BART Group - Accessibility-on-Demand
mailto:doug.lee@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx ; http://www.ssbbartgroup.com/
"While they were saying among themselves it cannot be done,
it was done." --Helen Keller
------------------------------
From: "Merv Keck" <blind5sparrow@xxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [jawsscripts] Re: Can Logos 4 be scripted?
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2012 18:50:03 -0400
I have Logos 4 Platinum Edition but am still a basic beginner when it comes
to scripting. However, I can tell you that Logos 4 is cloud based as opposed
to Logos 3. Since losing most of my usuable vision about 15 months ago I
have pretty much lost the ability to use many of my non -english language
studies such as Hebrew, Greek, and Akkadian cuneiform. The read aloud
drives me crazy and the accessibility features built into Logos 4 are
problematic but I understand from some other blind Logos 4 users that they
are trying to make Logos morfe accessible so I have high expectations
especially since I have over 2,000 resources tied up into Logos since 2001
and don't want to give up on it.
blind5sparrow
-----Original Message-----
From: Doug Lee
Sent: Sunday, June 17, 2012 6:39 PM
To: jawsscripts@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [jawsscripts] Re: Can Logos 4 be scripted?
If you're at all handy with Script Utility Mode, check out the window
class name of the main window, whether it has descendants, and whether
it has MSAA objects. If you have just a single window, no MSAA
objects, and no OSM text (which is what you already discovered), you
found a difficult case, and something like Hot Spot Clicker may be
your best bet. If you see a window tree and/or a set of MSAA objects,
it might be possible to script that.
On Sun, Jun 17, 2012 at 05:07:49PM -0400, John Thomas wrote:
Hi
A few years ago I wrote a set of scripts for version 3 of the Logos Bible
software program. A couple months after I finished, the Logos folks rolled
out version 4. It is built on a totally different platform. My evaluation of
version 4 is that it cannot be scripted. I just want to check my assumptions
with the list here to see if my assessment is correct.
I assume it cannot be scripted, because I cannot read any text with either
the JAWS or Invisible cursor. The only thing I can read is the name of the
program with the PC cursor. The cursor routing functions also do not work.
With the previous version, I could use the invisible cursor to read any text
that was visible to a sighted user. Since I cannot read anything with the
JAWS or Invisible cursors, I assume there is really nothing I can do with
version 4. Is this correct?
Thanks,
John
__________???
View the list's information and change your settings at
//www.freelists.org/list/jawsscripts
--
Doug Lee, Senior Accessibility Programmer
SSB BART Group - Accessibility-on-Demand
mailto:doug.lee@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx ; http://www.ssbbartgroup.com/
"While they were saying among themselves it cannot be done,
it was done." --Helen Keller
__________�
View the list's information and change your settings at
//www.freelists.org/list/jawsscripts
------------------------------
From: "Dean Masters" <dwmasters15@xxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [jawsscripts] Re: Can Logos 4 be scripted?
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2012 19:54:01 -0400
Logos 4 is based on wpf programming. So the only things JAWS can read is
what Logos puts in the program. With the latest update you can open a book
by using the library. then you can read the first line with a SayLine. Then
if you hit the down arrow and do a SayLine it just scrolls the text a few
words to the right.
I wrote a lot of scripts for Logos 3 years ago but nothing in Logos 4 is
scriptable.
I think with Windows 8 JAWS won't be able to use the visual hooks like in
earlier Windows so I wonder if we might be able to read the text with the
normal keystrokes once the new version of JAWS comes out?
They are trying to work on accessibility in Logos 4 but they onnly have the
demo version of JAWS. They told me that with NVDA they can read the text on
the screen. so that is why I am wondering if we might be able to when the
new version of JAWS comes out.
Dean
-----Original Message-----
From: Merv Keck
Sent: Sunday, June 17, 2012 6:50 PM
To: jawsscripts@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [jawsscripts] Re: Can Logos 4 be scripted?
I have Logos 4 Platinum Edition but am still a basic beginner when it comes
to scripting. However, I can tell you that Logos 4 is cloud based as opposed
to Logos 3. Since losing most of my usuable vision about 15 months ago I
have pretty much lost the ability to use many of my non -english language
studies such as Hebrew, Greek, and Akkadian cuneiform. The read aloud
drives me crazy and the accessibility features built into Logos 4 are
problematic but I understand from some other blind Logos 4 users that they
are trying to make Logos morfe accessible so I have high expectations
especially since I have over 2,000 resources tied up into Logos since 2001
and don't want to give up on it.
blind5sparrow
-----Original Message-----
From: Doug Lee
Sent: Sunday, June 17, 2012 6:39 PM
To: jawsscripts@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [jawsscripts] Re: Can Logos 4 be scripted?
If you're at all handy with Script Utility Mode, check out the window
class name of the main window, whether it has descendants, and whether
it has MSAA objects. If you have just a single window, no MSAA
objects, and no OSM text (which is what you already discovered), you
found a difficult case, and something like Hot Spot Clicker may be
your best bet. If you see a window tree and/or a set of MSAA objects,
it might be possible to script that.
On Sun, Jun 17, 2012 at 05:07:49PM -0400, John Thomas wrote:
Hi
A few years ago I wrote a set of scripts for version 3 of the Logos Bible
software program. A couple months after I finished, the Logos folks rolled
out version 4. It is built on a totally different platform. My evaluation of
version 4 is that it cannot be scripted. I just want to check my assumptions
with the list here to see if my assessment is correct.
I assume it cannot be scripted, because I cannot read any text with either
the JAWS or Invisible cursor. The only thing I can read is the name of the
program with the PC cursor. The cursor routing functions also do not work.
With the previous version, I could use the invisible cursor to read any text
that was visible to a sighted user. Since I cannot read anything with the
JAWS or Invisible cursors, I assume there is really nothing I can do with
version 4. Is this correct?
Thanks,
John
__________???
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--
Doug Lee, Senior Accessibility Programmer
SSB BART Group - Accessibility-on-Demand
mailto:doug.lee@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx ; http://www.ssbbartgroup.com/
"While they were saying among themselves it cannot be done,
it was done." --Helen Keller
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------------------------------
From: "John Thomas" <johnt@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [jawsscripts] Re: Can Logos 4 be scripted?
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2012 20:11:38 -0400
Hi Dean,
You made more progress than I did. I couldn't even figure out how to select
anything from the library page. Well I guess we have something to look
forward to regarding the next JAWS version.
Thank you for your report on Logos 4, and thank you to others who shared
their experiences and ideas.
John
-----Original Message-----
From: jawsscripts-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:jawsscripts-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Dean Masters
Sent: Sunday, June 17, 2012 7:54 PM
To: jawsscripts@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [jawsscripts] Re: Can Logos 4 be scripted?
Logos 4 is based on wpf programming. So the only things JAWS can read is
what Logos puts in the program. With the latest update you can open a book
by using the library. then you can read the first line with a SayLine. Then
if you hit the down arrow and do a SayLine it just scrolls the text a few
words to the right.
I wrote a lot of scripts for Logos 3 years ago but nothing in Logos 4 is
scriptable.
I think with Windows 8 JAWS won't be able to use the visual hooks like in
earlier Windows so I wonder if we might be able to read the text with the
normal keystrokes once the new version of JAWS comes out?
They are trying to work on accessibility in Logos 4 but they onnly have the
demo version of JAWS. They told me that with NVDA they can read the text on
the screen. so that is why I am wondering if we might be able to when the
new version of JAWS comes out.
Dean
-----Original Message-----
From: Merv Keck
Sent: Sunday, June 17, 2012 6:50 PM
To: jawsscripts@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [jawsscripts] Re: Can Logos 4 be scripted?
I have Logos 4 Platinum Edition but am still a basic beginner when it comes
to scripting. However, I can tell you that Logos 4 is cloud based as opposed
to Logos 3. Since losing most of my usuable vision about 15 months ago I
have pretty much lost the ability to use many of my non -english language
studies such as Hebrew, Greek, and Akkadian cuneiform. The read aloud
drives me crazy and the accessibility features built into Logos 4 are
problematic but I understand from some other blind Logos 4 users that they
are trying to make Logos morfe accessible so I have high expectations
especially since I have over 2,000 resources tied up into Logos since 2001
and don't want to give up on it.
blind5sparrow
-----Original Message-----
From: Doug Lee
Sent: Sunday, June 17, 2012 6:39 PM
To: jawsscripts@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [jawsscripts] Re: Can Logos 4 be scripted?
If you're at all handy with Script Utility Mode, check out the window class
name of the main window, whether it has descendants, and whether it has MSAA
objects. If you have just a single window, no MSAA objects, and no OSM text
(which is what you already discovered), you found a difficult case, and
something like Hot Spot Clicker may be your best bet. If you see a window
tree and/or a set of MSAA objects, it might be possible to script that.
On Sun, Jun 17, 2012 at 05:07:49PM -0400, John Thomas wrote:
Hi
A few years ago I wrote a set of scripts for version 3 of the Logos Bible
software program. A couple months after I finished, the Logos folks rolled
out version 4. It is built on a totally different platform. My evaluation of
version 4 is that it cannot be scripted. I just want to check my assumptions
with the list here to see if my assessment is correct.
I assume it cannot be scripted, because I cannot read any text with either
the JAWS or Invisible cursor. The only thing I can read is the name of the
program with the PC cursor. The cursor routing functions also do not work.
With the previous version, I could use the invisible cursor to read any text
that was visible to a sighted user. Since I cannot read anything with the
JAWS or Invisible cursors, I assume there is really nothing I can do with
version 4. Is this correct?
Thanks,
John
__________???
View the list's information and change your settings at
//www.freelists.org/list/jawsscripts
--
Doug Lee, Senior Accessibility Programmer SSB BART Group -
Accessibility-on-Demand mailto:doug.lee@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
http://www.ssbbartgroup.com/ "While they were saying among themselves it
cannot be done, it was done." --Helen Keller __________�
View the list's information and change your settings at
//www.freelists.org/list/jawsscripts
__________�
View the list's information and change your settings at
//www.freelists.org/list/jawsscripts
__________�
View the list's information and change your settings at
//www.freelists.org/list/jawsscripts
------------------------------
Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2012 20:37:42 -0400
From: Doug Lee <doug.lee@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [jawsscripts] Re: Can Logos 4 be scripted?
I've scripted for Microsoft Silverlight, which I believe shares much
with WPF. Would be interesting to know what's available there.
On Sun, Jun 17, 2012 at 07:54:01PM -0400, Dean Masters wrote:
Logos 4 is based on wpf programming. So the only things JAWS can read is
what Logos puts in the program. With the latest update you can open a book
by using the library. then you can read the first line with a SayLine. Then
if you hit the down arrow and do a SayLine it just scrolls the text a few
words to the right.
I wrote a lot of scripts for Logos 3 years ago but nothing in Logos 4 is
scriptable.
I think with Windows 8 JAWS won't be able to use the visual hooks like in
earlier Windows so I wonder if we might be able to read the text with the
normal keystrokes once the new version of JAWS comes out?
They are trying to work on accessibility in Logos 4 but they onnly have the
demo version of JAWS. They told me that with NVDA they can read the text on
the screen. so that is why I am wondering if we might be able to when the
new version of JAWS comes out.
Dean
-----Original Message-----
From: Merv Keck
Sent: Sunday, June 17, 2012 6:50 PM
To: jawsscripts@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [jawsscripts] Re: Can Logos 4 be scripted?
I have Logos 4 Platinum Edition but am still a basic beginner when it comes
to scripting. However, I can tell you that Logos 4 is cloud based as opposed
to Logos 3. Since losing most of my usuable vision about 15 months ago I
have pretty much lost the ability to use many of my non -english language
studies such as Hebrew, Greek, and Akkadian cuneiform. The read aloud
drives me crazy and the accessibility features built into Logos 4 are
problematic but I understand from some other blind Logos 4 users that they
are trying to make Logos morfe accessible so I have high expectations
especially since I have over 2,000 resources tied up into Logos since 2001
and don't want to give up on it.
blind5sparrow
-----Original Message-----
From: Doug Lee
Sent: Sunday, June 17, 2012 6:39 PM
To: jawsscripts@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [jawsscripts] Re: Can Logos 4 be scripted?
If you're at all handy with Script Utility Mode, check out the window
class name of the main window, whether it has descendants, and whether
it has MSAA objects. If you have just a single window, no MSAA
objects, and no OSM text (which is what you already discovered), you
found a difficult case, and something like Hot Spot Clicker may be
your best bet. If you see a window tree and/or a set of MSAA objects,
it might be possible to script that.
On Sun, Jun 17, 2012 at 05:07:49PM -0400, John Thomas wrote:
Hi
A few years ago I wrote a set of scripts for version 3 of the Logos Bible
software program. A couple months after I finished, the Logos folks rolled
out version 4. It is built on a totally different platform. My evaluation of
version 4 is that it cannot be scripted. I just want to check my assumptions
with the list here to see if my assessment is correct.
I assume it cannot be scripted, because I cannot read any text with either
the JAWS or Invisible cursor. The only thing I can read is the name of the
program with the PC cursor. The cursor routing functions also do not work.
With the previous version, I could use the invisible cursor to read any text
that was visible to a sighted user. Since I cannot read anything with the
JAWS or Invisible cursors, I assume there is really nothing I can do with
version 4. Is this correct?
Thanks,
John
__________???
View the list's information and change your settings at
//www.freelists.org/list/jawsscripts
--
Doug Lee, Senior Accessibility Programmer
SSB BART Group - Accessibility-on-Demand
mailto:doug.lee@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx ; http://www.ssbbartgroup.com/
"While they were saying among themselves it cannot be done,
it was done." --Helen Keller
__________???
View the list's information and change your settings at
//www.freelists.org/list/jawsscripts
__________???
View the list's information and change your settings at
//www.freelists.org/list/jawsscripts
__________???
View the list's information and change your settings at
//www.freelists.org/list/jawsscripts
--
Doug Lee, Senior Accessibility Programmer
SSB BART Group - Accessibility-on-Demand
mailto:doug.lee@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx ; http://www.ssbbartgroup.com/
"While they were saying among themselves it cannot be done,
it was done." --Helen Keller
------------------------------
End of jawsscripts Digest V6 #130
*********************************
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