** Hastings Rock Radio **
As promised then, I'd like to do a short test of the system to firstly do
an initial gauge of actually using it remotely and for everyone else to
take a listen to the Internet stream that it generates.
I'm one of the lucky(?) people able to work from home so that and
supporting a couple of other stations means I'm quite pushed for time but
ideally would like to try this tomorrow evening.
What I'd propose, starting from 8:30pm tomorrow evening is for some
volunteers (I'll need a minimum of one here!) to do a 5-10 minute test run
(suggest no more than half an hour total). To that end, anyone interested
needs to first take a look at the document I posted up last week:
https://www.oasw.co.uk/vmeeter/VMeeterRemotePlayout.pdf
and have at least worked through the first 7 pages which basically makes
sure your audio is working and you have downloaded the Teamviewer software
and verified it is starting up ok. I'd also recommend that you have read
the remainder of the DJ user guide - up to page 12 so you at least have an
idea of what to expect.
If you then drop either the list or me direct a mail saying you'd like to
participate, we can put a short schedule together. From 7:30pm I'll have
the system up and running so everyone can do an initial check, make sure
they can login and do some initial checks.
Thanks.
I've suggested to Jon & Nick that it might be best if we have some sort of
test of Jon's system before we make any kind of decision on this.
Jon is going to be putting a message up here this evening to that effect.
Stay tuned.
Andy
Andy Gunton
Phone: 07545 264247
________________________________
From: hrock-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <hrock-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> on behalf of
sfhrock <sfhrock@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: 29 March 2020 20:12
To: hrock@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <hrock@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [Hastings Rock] Re: Internet stream
** Hastings Rock Radio **
I do agree with Jon in as much it would be good to make the effort. I
would bring a sense of normality in times that are anything but.
It is interesting listening to the BBC where many of the presenters are
at home. You can hear the difference in audio quality between the home
sourced and studio sourced audio. I think they see the content as the
most important and a sense of normality above all, so the audio quality
takes a back seat. 'The Now Show' this week had a satirical poke at
doing their programme from home, a show that normally relies on a studio
audience.
I think the lack of FM is pretty much irrelevant with many people stuck
at home. Despite my initial misgivings, we have talked about internet
broadcasting before so if we don't try it now, when would we do it.
Simon.
On 29/03/2020 09:47, jon bird wrote:
** Hastings Rock Radio **--
I'll try and address some of the comments raised by Ralph yesterday.
Firstly and since he's mentioned it a couple of times, regarding what
I referred to as the "experimental" nature of all of this. Yes, there
is the usual getting used to a different environment side of things
and ironing out/possibly improving the extra software I've deployed
however to be honest I'm not particularly worried about that. The
software isn't that complicated, it's more "glue" that joins some
existing, pre-existing stuff together and we've got ~4 weeks for
people to play with this. What I mean here by "experimental" is that
what I'm proposing with the software and resources available now will
always be a bit of an experiment. Hence it doesn't matter whether you
do it now or in 6 months or a year. It really won't make a jot of
difference and here's why:
- My wife is using the same (Teamviewer) software to tutor some school
kids remotely. It's pretty good but every session or so they loose a
session mid way through and have to start again. This also happens
with pretty much every conferencing software I've used at work. It's
going to happen, there might be dead air as a result.
- The lag in the audio means presenters probably aren't going to sound
as professional as the usually do.
- The audio quality between DJ mic and the studio is really poor
because the technology we're using is designed for voice conferencing
not broadcast. So it doesn't matter whether you have a broadcast
quality mic or one on a laptop, you're going to sound like you're in a
cupboard. Or toilet. The levels might be a bit off but I would hope
every DJ will have remoted in before the broadcast and calibrated
their mic appropriately so that should be less of a problem.
- The same with the audio quality coming down the headphones to the
DJ, it's pretty rubbish. This means, as a DJ, you will be facing more
challenges and the experience probably won't be anywhere near as
enjoyable as normal. However my view as I said before, this year above
all else it's about the listeners not us and imho that really is the
pitch that needs to be put to the DJs.
If I get the chance, I'd like to look at improving the quality but
given there doesn't seem to be any pre-existing software out there
which offers this I have a suspicion that because of the keeping the
latency to an absolute minimum you have to sacrifice quality for that
unless you've got dedicated links. However even if I did figure
something out, it complicates the setup at the DJ end because they'd
need additional software setting up.
If we go ahead with this, there needs to be an acceptance of all the
above with the impact that the station *is* going to sound more
disjointed than usual.
I don't really have that much direct contact with the listeners
however I find it odd that especially under these exceptional times,
if we were to make the effort and it isn't as perfect as they are used
to the perception we have of them is that they'd say "WTF is HR
doing?" then disappear into the sunset in an affronted huff and never
come back. It's a bit like saying that because you now have to queue
to get into Tesco, you're never going to shop there again when this is
all over. If they do decide not to listen because they are
perfectionists then my answer is frankly - so what? Next year they'll
be back. There seems to be an implicit worry that we'll somehow
irretrievably tarnish the Hastings Rock brand by doing this whereas
imho I think it won't make a jot of difference and if anything will
actually enhance it because we're making he effort.
Finally, you are correct, the committee has not yet made a decision on
this however I am (and have been) pursuing this over the past few
weeks not just for Hastings Rock, a couple of other stations with
frankly more pressing needs (as in they are on air 24/7 now) than we
have are starting to trial it so I'm fairly well developed in terms of
setting it up and having it documented. Hence why I'm not doing any
real tailoring for us until there is a decision.
j.
In message <5396356A-2FCD-403A-BDF4-281C6BB9D3D7@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>,
Ralph <dmarc-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> writes
** Hastings Rock Radio **
Im agreeing with Simon.
Also Jon is correct in saying the peak listening is irrelevant as
Breakfast gets listened to coz people are getting ready for their day
be it work or school etc. Drive/ teatime show because its in the
title. People in cars listening on fm. Neither of which is happening
right now.
Im still of the view we should hold fire and bring this phase of HR
in slowly over a few weekends and build it up so we know it works and
sounds good. ( content wise I mean Jon not your software)
By content I mean DJs possibly using inferior mics, perhaps making
voice content distorted or unbalanced and above all the whole sound
of the station being disjointed
Why not (if we have to do it at all) start it on a weekend in May
then maybe a few evening shows and see how it is received
Its a game of two halves really
We could be broadcasting as Simon says to no one at all (save friends
and family of the presenter that s on) OR run the risk of HR fans
listening in and going WTF is HR doing.
I still think this sort of broadcast should be launched while we are
on FM and then carried on and improved in the future.
As Simon says am I the only one not getting carried away with this
great idea and I am NOT putting barriers up either just saying how I
see it
Also. I dont remember the committee voting as to whether to go
ahead with this, just Nick saying lets do it man ?
Cheers R
Sent from my iPhone
On 28 Mar 2020, at 13:01, jon bird <hrock@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
?** Hastings Rock Radio **
And (at the expense of possibly denting the ego of some DJs), there
will almost certainly be some people who will listen in during
periods of automation precisely because of the *lack* of someone
waffling away between tracks.
However (and I will post something a bit more in a bit because Sarah
had the right idea) I think you are still in the mindset of trying
to run it in the same vein as we normally do, we can't, it's going
to have to be a lot more fluid on both our side of things and how
the listeners find stuff out. There may not even *be* a schedule as
such, I'm envisaging that this sort of thing will be posted out, at
fairly short notice on the FB page and that will form the hub of how
we communicate this stuff. And yes, I know there are some people who
"don't do Facebook" but unfortunately in these times you may just
have to get over that and join (at least in the short term).
In message <1d0c943a-3d00-acee-f024-fc5472814832@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>,
sfhrock <sfhrock@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> writes
** Hastings Rock Radio **
I think the only problem with a random schedule (e.g outside a
limited
set of broadcast hours) is that people will not be listening.
Personally
I do not listen to automated programming, by that I mean un-hosted,
because it is so boring, particularly with limited playlists. So if
someone decided they would link in and present a one off, I would
think
that it is unlikely to be heard except by accident.
I am not trying to put up barriers but I cannot be the only one who
thinks like this.
Simon.
On 28/03/2020 09:37, jon bird wrote:
** Hastings Rock Radio **
I'll add a bit more detail later when I have time but....
WHAT IM NOT SURE ABOUT IS how a dj can use their free choice as i
dont
how that would work , can you enlighten please Jon B .
Where do they normally get their free choice from? If it's an
existing
track within the Playout system, then just pick it from the music
list
as usual. If it's say from a CD then clearly that is a no-go. The
only
other option would be if they have the it as an MP3 file or
something,
it's possible to drop it into the system but I'm not sure how viable
that is for most DJs.
The other thing I'll just add quickly is that I'm puzzled as to why
we're putting up barriers already - I saw a post earlier that
suggested "no specialist shows", Nick (below) saying "no DJs' after
6pm". Why? If DJs are available at those times and/or have shows
they
want to present why would we stop them? Given we're going to be
short
of people anyway and for those than can/are working from home, after
6pm is most likely going to be their best availability anyway.
I'll try to answer more of the comments/queries later, I also plan
to
get the machine up and running so people can have a play over the
weekend. In the meantime, for those keen to see a bit more detail
this:
https://www.oasw.co.uk/vmeeter/VMeeterRemotePlayout.pdf
is a document that covers the setup and general instructions. For
DJ's, only the first 11 pages are relevant the rest is studio setup.
This is a fairly generic document, I plan to do a more tailored
version for Hastings Rock if we want to go ahead with it - it's also
an evolving work in progress.
j.
In message <E1jHt6u-0008Ap-Nk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>, Nick Apps
<nick@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> writes
Here is my vision .
if we can get 4 or 5 that can do the internet broadcast that would
enough . they wouldent need to comit to everyday .
There would be no djs after 6pm but we can repeat all the
specialist
shows from last year . Jon B has everYthing still .
Also, maybe, some spelilist shows could go out live without
remoting
the playout system . For instances Sarahs new Rock show .
we would all be folowing the playlist during the day . so when
then is
no dj just music, the list continues .
Kerrang radio have 2x 2hour shows that has no dj during the day .
WHAT IM NOT SURE ABOUT IS how a dj can use their free choice as i
dont
how that would work , can you enlighten please Jon B .
Nick.
Sent from Mail for Windows 10
From: Sarah Shirley
Sent: 26 March 2020 20:18
To: hrock@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [Hastings Rock] Re: Internet stream
** Hastings Rock Radio **
I think we are probably a bit ambitious if we believe that we can
fill
the
schedule up every day for 28 days on an internet based solution.
Most
internet stations (including the ones I do shows for), just look
to do
live
shows (or even pre-recorded shows) when DJs are available to do
them
and for
the rest of the time their auto DJ kicks in. Either allowing
requests
or not
allowing requests depending on time of day.
The policy on Slammintunes is to jump on air if no show is
scheduled
and
nobody else has already jumped on, but only when there is a gap
in the
schedule.
We do have to guard against people who want to 'hog' the air as
well.
For
instance, a wall to wall Phill The Bus would do my head in, so it
has
to be
controlled.
Specialist shows, I would suggest, can wait for the re-scheduled
broadcast.
I know that there are going to be gaps in the schedule but these
are
exceptional circumstances, and as I maintain, something is better
than
nothing.
Sarah
-----Original Message-----
From: jon bird
Sent: Thursday, March 26, 2020 7:59 PM
To: hrock@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [Hastings Rock] Re: Internet stream
** Hastings Rock Radio **
In message
<AM6PR09MB44884AA5D44D368E9F05A079D4CF0@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx.outlo
ok.com>, Andy Gunton <andygunton@xxxxxxxxxxx> writes
Good work Jon.
I think there's a real basis for something that could work here,
although we'd obviously have to sort out the details before
committing
to it.
I agree that we should sort out the streaming service asap, in
case we
want to use it.
I do have a couple of points/questions though:
*How many people are going to be able to listen to any internet
broadcast? I understand it's only 50 at present? We need more
coverage than that. How much would that cost & is that easyset
to
up?
Assuming the streaming server people are still able to set things
up
for
us, it's fairly cheap. Last year I think I actually paid for 100
listeners (came to about £7.50/month) but because of the way we
split
the bandwidth up (with two different bitrates) in theory that would
have
given us 200. I think we could increase this figure once we're
under
way
if necessary, fairly sure I did that for someone else last year.
*Is it only DJs in the second category that can use their own
music
for free choices etc? I'm guessing so.
In theory it would be possible for presenters to drag 'n drop audio
files onto the Playout machine, Teamviewer allows for that but it
wasn't
something I was proposing to advertise to avoid over complicating
things.
*As we're only looking to cover the daytime is it worth going
down
the specialist show route? I suggest not & think we should
keep
things as simple as possible & have everything playlisted,
with
free choices as normal. Nick & myself are still working on
updating the current playlist btw.
*What are we intending to broadcast when a live DJ is not
available
& for the hours outside of the daytime when we won't be live
anyway? I'm guessing Robojock wouldn't work.
*My main concern is the amount of DJs we will have to cover
the 28
days. The last thing we want is to have the same DJs on all
the
time. My fear is that many won't be able to be involved duenot
to
having the equipment, but mainly because many won't have the
space/environment/peace & quiet in their household to do a
live
broadcast. Barking dogs & children playing in the
background etc
don't make for good radio. Let's not forget that many more
people
are at home than normal atm, a situation that is likely to
get
worse before it gets better. Kids are off school & many are
working from home. I have doubts that I'd be able to do a
live
show for those reasons. Not trying to be negative, just
playing
devils advocate.
I think it would be down for the committee as a whole to decide how
re-arrange the schedule for this, I suspect initially driven by DJ
availability. My initial thoughts are you may want to start out
fairly
small scale, say just breakfast and drivetime live and build on
that.
Robojock/automation are certainly an option however DJs have been
recording their shows for a good number of years now so we could
re-air
some of those (even as a minimum I still have a stack of them on
the
server from last year). I also don't see any reason why we should
abandon the specialist shows should people still want to do them.
If we
still have the schedule from then, given they are all date/time
stamped
it may be possible to air them in a sensible fashion. Simon also
raised
the prospect of people pre-recording their shows in advance, with
their
own music which is also viable.
I think flexibility has to be the thing here, we're used to
working on
a
schedule planned out for the next week and I think that is the
wrong
approach here. Have a schedule that plans for the worst case - a
lot of
automation/pre-recorded stuff but allow DJ's to come along on short
notice and say "hey I can do something between 3-4 today" - let
them do
that. Or "I can record something tonight" which can then be
slotted in
at a convenient time the following day. It could even be repeated
at a
later date. Shake things up a bit, in a way it's quite fun not
knowing
what you might hear when you turn on the radio....
--
== jon bird - OAS Software
== Hastings Rock Radio, IT secondment
== http://www.onasticksoftware.co.uk/
== email: hrock@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Simon.
