It is always hard to diagnose and fix a problem just by e-mail, as there can be many causes, but here are some ideas: First make sure that the horses are hitched right and harness is adjusted properly. If they are pulling away from the pole, try lenthening the pole straps as well as the coupling reins. Yes, a yoke is much better than pole straps as the horses can work straight much better. Try switching the horses between left and right horse (keep doing that later anyways to not make them one sided). Those are the first and easy steps, but then comes the really much more important stuff, the proper training and driving: Drive them STRAIGHT. Keep CONTACT on BOTH horses, make them BOTH do equal work.Use your whip on the outside of each to bring them to the pole. Do so at the WALK. Keep them RELAXED They need to learn to stay relaxed even when you touch them with the whip. That is important. Train for it if you can't. It may take some time. When you can walk relaxed and straight, then do large circles at the walk, and drive your INSIDE horse forward with the whip on the inside of the circle (so the whip not on the pole side in between the horses). Do large figure 8's with going STRAIGHT in the middle (don't make an X in the middle going on diagonals, the figure 8 are two perfectly round circles!). At the figure 8 after each circle the direction changes, and since we want to drive the INSIDE horse forward, that means, in each circle the outside horse has time off and can relax, and the inside horse is driven, and after each circle it changes, who is inside and who is outside, so it changes who has to work and who has time off. With working the inside horse with the whip on the inside you want to get the inside horse to bend properly and NOT let him go counterbent and over the shoulder and pulling away from the pole. But you can do so only AFTER you first were able to drive them straight on a straight line! If they pull away from the pole in the circle, then your circle is too small. Make it larger. With horses 40 meter circles to start, later 30 then 20 meters when they are good. With ponies or VSE's a bit smaller accordingly. So with VSE's I'd start with 20 meter circles. When you can do all that well at the walk, only then work on the same at the trot! Stay away from doing small corners in a dressage arena. That's too small a circle, they can't do that in the beginning. That makes them anxious and produces the counter bending of the inside horse and the pulling away from the pole. Same as do hazards with to tight and fast turns! Very counterproductive for a young pair, but great fun, when they have learned their stuff and always bend properly. It's work and it may take a few sessions, but it's badly needed and will produce results! I have posted before about Emil 8's and why to drive the inside horse. Perhaps you'll like to look it up in the archives, or somebody still has that post handy and can repost it. Quickly in a nutshell (Can I ever do that? :-) Why drive the inside horse? When I drive the inside horse, then the carriage is pulled on the inside, which makes the pole wanting to go to the outside = away from the circle, and that's great, because then I can take a little more inside rein and with that get my inside horse properly bent. So using the whip on the inside of the inside horse does two things, it drives him forward which we want for the bending, and it also encourages him to bend at the same time already. The only exception to this is, when making a fast turn in a hazard, then I drive the outside horse which brings the pole around quicker. But let's forget that for now, there is plenty of time to do that, when the horses are properly trained to bend properly all the time! Doing it before will produce counterbending and pulling away from the pole, exactly the problem so many lower level pair drivers are having. So all you beginning pair drivers, DRIVE THE INSIDE HORSE, that gives you the bending of the inside horse, and don't worry about the outside horse, they usually lean over to the pole in the turn anyhow, besides, they don't need to bend as much as the inside horse since their turn is wider anyhow. Hardly ever do we see outside horses counterbent in turns when the inside horse is bending properly, so don't worry about the outside horse. You have a distinct advantage here over all the single drivers, because with the pair, and driving the inside horse, the carriage helps you to get the bending. That nice help you can't get when driving single. Figure 8 benefits: One horse works while the other has time off. So we constantly switch and give one a little break and only work the other one. That's great already to keep them relaxed and happy in training. Next benefit: The inside horse needs to shorten stride a little as his distance is shorter and the outside horse needs to lengthen stride a little as his route is a little longer on the outside, so they learn to adjust their stride, which will result in the nice picture that everybody uhhs and ahhs about, when pairs are going in stride. Hey, they like to do that by themselves, same as we do. When two people take a walk together at the beach or in the woods, most try to be in stride automatically, most without even noticing (unless their strides are very different), it carries a conversation much better. Horses are no different. They like to be in stride, and the figure 8 teaches them to adjust their strides, so that they later can do it much easier on their own. Now quickly to the last question that was asked here with horses of different length. No idea why somebody told you the butts should be even. I wouldn't do that. I like the heads - if possible also the chests, but for me, mainly the heads - to be even and adjust the traces and reins accordingly, but after that again comes the hard work: Driving them evenly, as almost no pair is equally eager in pulling, and you always have to go after the lazy one and make him do his fair share, constantly! If you don't, it will make the eager one hotter and hotter and the problems bigger and bigger. Good luck Hardy _________________________________________________________ To Unsubscribe, change to Digest or Vacation mode go to: http://www.drivingpairs.com/dpmem.shtml `````````````````````````````````````````````````````````