Yes! And, I probably did misspeak about 15 versus 20 amp circuits. The only things connecting the actually now 3 rooms all of which are on stepped down 220 lines are XLR cables carrying audio. Each room has a single 4 outlet box, where there used to be a 220 line.
Nick----- Original Message ----- From: "Dave Carlson" <dgcarlson@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <ddots-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Monday, September 21, 2009 12:27 AMSubject: [ddots-l] Re: [Bulk] Re: getting shocked by equipment in home studio, any sug gest ions?
Nick, I'm a bit surprised at this: "These isolated sets of 2 15-amp circuits per each of these rooms are..." Outlet wiring (at least in the U.S. is minimum 20 Amps. It's the light fixtures that are usually on 15 Amp circuits.I do agree with your wiring of the dedicated sets of outlets from two phases of the 220 Vac mains -- that's a good practice to balance the load. However I would keep my gear (including computer) all connected to the same phase of the 220 V to remove the possibility of any 58Vac potential difference due torunning off different legs. In other words, one room on one phase and another on the other is fine, but avoid having your keyboard connected to one phase and your mixing board to the other. The eddy currents can be problematic. Dave----- Original Message ----- From: "Nick Dotson" <nickdotson@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>To: <ddots-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2009 19:19 Subject: [Bulk] [ddots-l] Re: getting shocked by equipment in home studio, any sug gest ions? When I moved into my home in 1978, I found that all but the 220VAC outletswere 2-wire, and contracted with an electrician to have the outlets changedout. When the city inspected, the electrician got busted for havingexchanged the outlets for ones with 3-prong faceplates, but he had used the same 2-wire wiring without any ground wire. He lost his city license, got afine, but managed not to go to jail. I had to spend allot of additionalmoney to have the place rewired to properly grounded wiring. And when I putin the studio and studio control room, I was advised by electricians, and did, have separate isolates circuits run having their own drop from the power pole's distribution box. Suffice it to say, they're quiet, as contrasted to taking power from any of the house's pre-existing circuits.These isolated sets of 2 15-amp circuits per each of these rooms are steppeddown from 220 lines. Nick----- Original Message ----- From: "Cameron" <cameron@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>To: <ddots-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2009 7:50 PMSubject: [ddots-l] Re: getting shocked by equipment in home studio, any suggest ions?Hi. No it's not, but this happens whether my amp is on or not. Cameron. -----Original Message----- From: ddots-l-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:ddots-l-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of albertm13@xxxxxxxx Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2009 9:38 PM To: ddots-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [ddots-l] Re: getting shocked by equipment in home studio, any sug gest ions? Sean, I'm talking about a real short. If his amp's case is somehow connected the hot wire and then the ground is really connected to the case as it should be then that will make a short circuit. As I said before, this is what the ground is supposed to do; it will make the circuit unuseable until the problem's corrected. Cameron, Is your amp connected to the same outlet as everything else? Albert ---------- Original Message ---------- From: "Sean A. Cummins" <seanacummins@xxxxxxxxx> To: <ddots-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Subject: [ddots-l] Re: getting shocked by equipment in home studio, any suggest ions? Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2009 16:33:11 -0700 Albert, Normally you would connect the small ground wire to the center screw of theoutlet, but in this case if indeed the electrical wiring isn't up to code,the outlet isn't grounded as well, and connecting the wire to the center would result in nothing.Your saying " causing a short", isn't analogous to his situation. A shortis typically misnomer for a hot line that is directly connecting to the ground, or common. If he has voltage traveling through a heating system, he would have bigger problems then a ground issue. Though very rare that voltage could be flowing through piping, everyone in the building would have dead pets and children. Sean----- Original Message ----- From: <albertm13@xxxxxxxx>To: <ddots-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2009 2:51 PM Subject: [ddots-l] Re: getting shocked by equipment in home studio, any suggest ions? Sean's fix is good to do but it sounds like something is connected wrong and you'll still have the problem. His solution may even cause a short which will make the circuit unuseable until it is fixed correctly. This is actually what the ground is supposed to do. Whether it is you someone else: Get a voltmeter and connect it from your guitar ground on the cable to the ground of an outlet and if you read anything more than 10V then you should get your amp fixed or at least checked. Even if the meter reads 20V it might be OK but I don't want to be respobsilble for your death. Albert ---------- Original Message ---------- From: "Sean A. Cummins" <seanacummins@xxxxxxxxx> To: <ddots-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Subject: [ddots-l] Re: getting shocked by equipment in home studio, any suggest ions? Date: Sun, 20 Sep 2009 06:43:32 -0700 Cameron, sounds like your building is definitely not up to code. However, you can usually resolve this problem by adding a three prong to two prong adapter that has a wire coming off for the ground prong. Splice at least 14 or 12 gauge wire to the wire on the adaptor using a wire nut. You want to make this long enough to go to the nearest copper or iron piping like a baseboard heater or old fashion iron radiator . You will need to fasten the bare end of the wire to one of the pipes either by rapping thestripped wire around the copper pipe and twisting it back on to itself, oreven an alligator clip, that can be purchased even at Radio Crap, and clipping it to one of the heat fins of the base board. Using the old radiator, you can even solder the end to the iron pipe, but you need to make sure it is iron. If it is copper, you can cause electrolysis to cause the pipe to begin to brake-down , and eventually leak, or worse, burst. Remember, if it is painted, which most people have ignorantly dun, you will need to remove a little area of paint, or just find an area, like the valve control, that is bare iron or steel to attach the wire.The concept is that, all heating systems will eventually be touching earthsome where in its travels through the building. The ultimate and safest way of grounding is to drive a rebar stake into real earth and running the wire to this. But not knowing how far you are from actual earth, makes this a sketchy statement at best. By law, the building owner should have an electrician come and evaluate your need, he/she wont want a lawsuit over such a little matter. Also, if you haven't already experienced this, what ever you do, don't play your guitar and let your lips touch the mic at the same time, before you have fixed the problem. You will get a very painful shock when your lips ground to the mic, because the lips have vast amount of nerve endings. WATCH OUT! I'm warning you, and I'm not kidding!! Sean----- Original Message ----- From: <albertm13@xxxxxxxx>To: <ddots-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Sunday, September 20, 2009 5:47 AM Subject: [ddots-l] Re: getting shocked by equipment in home studio, any suggest ions? Cameron,Is it a static electricity shock? Do you get one short shock and then youcan hold the mic? Albert ---------- Original Message ---------- From: "Cameron" <cameron@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> To: <ddots-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Subject: [ddots-l] Re: getting shocked by equipment in home studio, any suggest ions? Date: Sat, 19 Sep 2009 16:25:31 -0400Hi. it happens with dynamic and condenser mics, and even when the phantompower is off for the condensers.plastic mic clips being used since I only have small diafram condensers atpresent. Cameron. -----Original Message----- From: ddots-l-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:ddots-l-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Nick Dotson Sent: Saturday, September 19, 2009 4:31 PM To: ddots-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [ddots-l] Re: getting shocked by equipment in home studio, any suggest ions? Remember static electricity with carpet? Also, is the mic condenser with phantom power or dynamic? In either event is the mic mount a spider mount, or, just one which you screw onto the boom? It's probably plastic, but I'm wondering if there is a grounding problem, if the mic and stand are breaking or floating the ground? Nick----- Original Message ----- From: "Cameron" <cameron@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>To: <ddots-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Saturday, September 19, 2009 12:30 PM Subject: [ddots-l] Re: getting shocked by equipment in home studio, any suggest ions?Hi. No no no, it's not just when you touch a mic. it's when you touch anything metal connected to the power conditioner, like the control surface, computer, audio interface, and the conditioner itself. as soon as the mic is unplugged, everything is back to normal. Cameron. -----Original Message----- From: ddots-l-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:ddots-l-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of D!J!X! Sent: Saturday, September 19, 2009 2:02 PM To: ddots-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [ddots-l] Re: getting shocked by equipment in home studio, any suggest ions? Interesting, and you get shocked everytime you touch a mic plugged into the mixer??? How about when you touch the mixer itself? D!J!X! -----Original Message----- From: ddots-l-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:ddots-l-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Cameron Sent: Saturday, September 19, 2009 12:45 PM To: ddots-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [ddots-l] Re: getting shocked by equipment in home studio, any suggest ions? carpet. -----Original Message----- From: ddots-l-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:ddots-l-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of D!J!X! Sent: Saturday, September 19, 2009 1:36 PM To: ddots-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [ddots-l] Re: getting shocked by equipment in home studio, any suggest ions? Put on shoes and try it, or wait, are you on carpet? D!J!X! -----Original Message----- From: ddots-l-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:ddots-l-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Cameron Sent: Saturday, September 19, 2009 12:32 PM To: ddots-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [ddots-l] Re: getting shocked by equipment in home studio, any suggest ions? Hi. not wearing shoes, my desk is not metal, and I am not touching the mics when I get shocked. although, touching the mics will shcok me too if I do. they are all 3 prong outlets. Cameron. -----Original Message----- From: ddots-l-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:ddots-l-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of albertm13@xxxxxxxx Sent: Saturday, September 19, 2009 9:57 AM To: ddots-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [ddots-l] Re: getting shocked by equipment in home studio, any suggest ions? Hi, If you have three pronged outlets you could possibly start by going to a hardware store and buying an outlet tester. Sorry, I couldn't find one at homedepot.com. You can read about them at en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Receptacle_tester and www.acmehowto.com/howto/homemaintenance/electrical/outlettest.php Make sure you get one that can be plugged into the outlet and not just put near the outlet. You would need sighted help because they only have lights. They are not expenssive. If you have two pronged outlets then it's probably a bad piece of equipment on your end but turning the plugs around might help. I don't know of an easy way for you to test for the problem without a voltmeter. If the problem isn't your house wiring then you need someone who could figure out what piece of your equipment is causing this problem. Old pieces of equipment like a tube amps are notorious for causing this problem. Whenever you get shocked, electricity flows through you which means it hasto go in one part of you and out another. Birds on power lines don't getkilled because they are only touching one thing. You are touching your mics but you must be touching something else too. That's why someone else recommended a rubber mat. Using a rubber mat is only hiding the problem butthe problem is still there. Are you wearing shoes? Perhaps your desk ismetal and it is touching something. Albert --- Cameron wrote ---Hi all. I have a problem, hopefully someone can give me some suggestionsor shed some light on why this is happening. The apartment complex I'm living in now was built in the early sixties I believe. The outlets are not very good, worn out, you can't plug anythinginto the top of any of them because it just falls out. You can only plugthings into the bottom plug. Anyways, when I was using my FW1884, I didn't notice any issues with anything except for noise because I am on a dirty circuit/loop being shared by all sorts of appliances and god knows what else.My current setup is now my ADK rack mount machine, Motu896 MKIII firewire interface, and BCF2000 control surface, which is all plugged into a powerconditioner. I started doing some tracking with my new gear for a new job this week andwhenever I used a mic that required phantom power, as soon as the mic wasplugged into the interface, I would get shocked if I touched anything metalthat was plugged into the conditioner, including the mic itself computer,control surface, interface, etc, . It's not enough to cause damage, but it is unplesent and is enough of a jolt to make you quickly stop touching whatever control you're touching. This happens even when the phantom power is switched off for every channel on the interface. I found out this afternoon that it also happens with dynamic mics too. As soon as all mics are unplugged, everything is fine. My power conditioner doesn't appear to have a ground lift switch. Is thisthe issue? Is there anything I can do to remedy this? I've got 5 monthsof writing and recording ahead and I really don't want to be freaking shocked every time I touch my gear!I'm going to make this issue known to the apartment manager on Monday butI really doubt they will understand what I'm talking about, or give a damn for that matter. Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated! Thanks, Cameron. ____________________________________________________________ Best Weight Loss Program - Click Here!http://thirdpartyoffers.juno.com/TGL2131/fc/BLSrjnsEGrEk4pskLBP4ZOsBHxT0WgIYT56vO82nb4RJqjhTY7eqkoksJUk/ PLEASE READ THIS FOOTER AT LEAST ONCE! 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