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On Jan 29, 2014, at 9:37 AM, ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx wrote:
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Constellation Talk Group
6 New Messages
Digest #2412
1.1
Re: Exclusion by "Barbara Morgan"
1.2
Re: Exclusion by "Maria Dolenc"
2.1
Re: suffering from representatives by "Chuck Cogliandro" mkdrum1
2.2
Re: suffering from representatives by "Robert Grant"
2.3
Re: suffering from representatives by "Joe pirone"
3a
Re: Digest Number 2409 Suffering from Representatives by "gary stuart"
garystuart
Messages
1.1
Re: Exclusion
Tue Jan 28, 2014 6:46 am (PST) . Posted by:
"Barbara Morgan"
Interesting topic you raise Steven and one I am consistently involved with
in my role as Editor of The Knowing Field.Building on my values for the
journal of a basically inclusive publication, I often find myself in the
position of wanting to include vigorously opposing points of view or sets
of values and that is a precarious and sometimes dangerous position to be
in. I experienced recently stepping into such a field and unconsciously
getting caught up in the field on more than one occasion during the editing
process. Fascinating.
Whatever the wider, more spiritual aspects of inclusion and exclusion I
think on a personal level, the issue runs very deep and I think different
cultures manage this in different ways. Here in the UK (and do I have the
right to include Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland - or even Southern
Ireland in my generalised viewpoint?), I think we are masters (and
mistresses) at excluding anyone or anything we feel uncomfortable about or
with. Cutting off from family members, work colleagues, friends, rather
than dealing with, or facing the hurt of, difficult and painful feelings is
more the norm than the exception I suspect. And of course, I am not
exception here. I do my best to include but there are times when I too
exclude for whatever reason and I feel and have felt the pain of exclusion
on more than one occasion.
My paternal grandfather was an excluded person. I never met him. None of
his five children had any contact with him for all of their adult lives.
The story, which I don't doubt was largely true, was that he was violent
and yet, through the constellation work, I have seen wider issues which may
have strongly impacted his way of being. Building on what Katja says, this
man died within six weeks of my grandmother whom he hadn't seen for over 50
years. The excluded cannot really ever be fully excluded I can't remember
who said it, maybe Bert, but I like the saying:
"Those whom we reject we imitate."
I look forward to ongoing discussion of this scintillating topic.
Warm wishes to all
Barbara
On 23 January 2014 07:01, Steve Vinay Gunther <spirited@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
I am writing about a topic that's a little difficult.
In the constellation ethos, exclusion is understood, generally, to be a
source of entanglements.
One of the things I have really valued about the constellation community
itself is the degree of inclusiveness that is widely exhibited. So many
different facilitators, with their different styles, yet there seems to be
a general ability to get along. This open, field-oriented inclusiveness is
something I find a bit special, and sets the constellation community apart
in my experience.
However, recently I was dismayed to find an unmistakable example of
exclusion on the peer level in one area of the constellation community.
This experience was rapidly and clearly confirmed, and the gate to dialogue
was shut down completely.
Now, in the realm of human experience, people engage in all sorts of
behaviours, for their own reasons, and obviously influenced by their own
field. But I thought to raise it, as perhaps its a difficult thing to
discuss exclusionary behaviour within our own community, by people who hold
certain positions, in roles of some power and influence.
I certainly felt impacted by it, and somewhat powerless in the face being
excluded without any possibility of discussion.
I am interested in other's reflections on this issue. I guess that given
the high valance given to the topic, somewhere it will form a disowned
shadow.
Vinay
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Rest in natural great peace
this exhausted mind
beaten helplessly by
karma and neurotic thought
like the relentless fury
of the pounding waves
In the infinite ocean
of samsara.
rest in natural great peace.
- Nyoshul Khenpo Rinpoche
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Workshops | Training | Gestalt Therapy
Career Coaching | Relationship Help
Steve Vinay Gunther | *Director*
USA +1 323 391 9810 | Australia +61(2) 8064 7431
w www.depth.net.au <http://depth.net.au> | e spirited@xxxxxxxxxxxx
<https://www.facebook.com/stevevinaygunther>
<https://www.facebook.com/stevevinaygunther>
--
I
Barbara Morgan
Family Constellations Trainer, Supervisor & Practitioner
Editor of
The Knowing Field
International Constellations Journal
www.cominghome.org.uk
www.theknowingfield.com
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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Top ^
1.2
Re: Exclusion
Tue Jan 28, 2014 2:13 pm (PST) . Posted by:
"Maria Dolenc"
Hello Everyone and thank you Barbara for your post today..
I can really relate on a personal level to what you shared Barbara and the
challenge of how to be inclusive to all, and at the same time still keeping
and maintaining my values and integrity. I believe that to be the life
journey for us all. The longer I am on this planet the more I understand that
I can only see through „my coloured glasses‰ and that everyone else are
wearing different glasses.
My main lessons in life are about Being Ok with All... and as Hellinger says
: "Acknowledging WHAT IS"... I still often argue with „reality‰ and want it
to be different ...and that is when I suffer.
Being human is at times very challenging.
Thank you Vinay for opening this beautiful sharing ∑
Maria Dolenc
0425 277 279
mariadolenc@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
www.mariadolenc.com.au
On 29 Jan 2014, at 1:46 am, Barbara Morgan <theknowingfield@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Interesting topic you raise Steven and one I am consistently involved with
in my role as Editor of The Knowing Field.Building on my values for the
journal of a basically inclusive publication, I often find myself in the
position of wanting to include vigorously opposing points of view or sets
of values and that is a precarious and sometimes dangerous position to be
in. I experienced recently stepping into such a field and unconsciously
getting caught up in the field on more than one occasion during the editing
process. Fascinating.
Whatever the wider, more spiritual aspects of inclusion and exclusion I
think on a personal level, the issue runs very deep and I think different
cultures manage this in different ways. Here in the UK (and do I have the
right to include Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland - or even Southern
Ireland in my generalised viewpoint?), I think we are masters (and
mistresses) at excluding anyone or anything we feel uncomfortable about or
with. Cutting off from family members, work colleagues, friends, rather
than dealing with, or facing the hurt of, difficult and painful feelings is
more the norm than the exception I suspect. And of course, I am not
exception here. I do my best to include but there are times when I too
exclude for whatever reason and I feel and have felt the pain of exclusion
on more than one occasion.
My paternal grandfather was an excluded person. I never met him. None of
his five children had any contact with him for all of their adult lives.
The story, which I don't doubt was largely true, was that he was violent
and yet, through the constellation work, I have seen wider issues which may
have strongly impacted his way of being. Building on what Katja says, this
man died within six weeks of my grandmother whom he hadn't seen for over 50
years. The excluded cannot really ever be fully excluded I can't remember
who said it, maybe Bert, but I like the saying:
"Those whom we reject we imitate."
I look forward to ongoing discussion of this scintillating topic.
Warm wishes to all
Barbara
On 23 January 2014 07:01, Steve Vinay Gunther <spirited@xxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
I am writing about a topic that's a little difficult.
In the constellation ethos, exclusion is understood, generally, to be a
source of entanglements.
One of the things I have really valued about the constellation community
itself is the degree of inclusiveness that is widely exhibited. So many
different facilitators, with their different styles, yet there seems to be
a general ability to get along. This open, field-oriented inclusiveness is
something I find a bit special, and sets the constellation community apart
in my experience.
However, recently I was dismayed to find an unmistakable example of
exclusion on the peer level in one area of the constellation community.
This experience was rapidly and clearly confirmed, and the gate to
dialogue
was shut down completely.
Now, in the realm of human experience, people engage in all sorts of
behaviours, for their own reasons, and obviously influenced by their own
field. But I thought to raise it, as perhaps its a difficult thing to
discuss exclusionary behaviour within our own community, by people who
hold
certain positions, in roles of some power and influence.
I certainly felt impacted by it, and somewhat powerless in the face being
excluded without any possibility of discussion.
I am interested in other's reflections on this issue. I guess that given
the high valance given to the topic, somewhere it will form a disowned
shadow.
Vinay
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Rest in natural great peace
this exhausted mind
beaten helplessly by
karma and neurotic thought
like the relentless fury
of the pounding waves
In the infinite ocean
of samsara.
rest in natural great peace.
- Nyoshul Khenpo Rinpoche
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Workshops | Training | Gestalt Therapy
Career Coaching | Relationship Help
Steve Vinay Gunther | *Director*
USA +1 323 391 9810 | Australia +61(2) 8064 7431
w www.depth.net.au <http://depth.net.au> | e spirited@xxxxxxxxxxxx
<https://www.facebook.com/stevevinaygunther>
<https://www.facebook.com/stevevinaygunther>
--
I
Barbara Morgan
Family Constellations Trainer, Supervisor & Practitioner
Editor of
The Knowing Field
International Constellations Journal
www.cominghome.org.uk
www.theknowingfield.com
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Maria Dolenc
0425 277 279
mariadolenc@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
www.mariadolenc.com.au
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Top ^
2.1
Re: suffering from representatives
Tue Jan 28, 2014 1:20 pm (PST) . Posted by:
"Chuck Cogliandro" mkdrum1
I have great respect for this group and really appreciate the opportunity to
share ideas and perspectives. When we give representatives guidance we tell
them some simple things: that's there's nothing for them to do or think
about, but be open, relax and breathe; that they may feel nothing, which is
fine; and we lead them in some silent statements to themselves that they are
not [their name], that they are [the person they are representing], and that
they are in service to the healing of the client and the client's family. As
facilitators we hold that as the highest intention for the constellation-
that everyone is serving the client and the healing of that particular family
system.
If a representative begins to feel too much of their own unresolved energies,
they will be less available to be open to the sensations, impressions and
most importantly the energies of the family member. It takes a real practice
of multi-dimensional awareness to hold the energies of who you're
representing, not lose your self in the representation, and remember that
you're serving the needs of the client and the process of the constellation.
I've had representatives be so overwhelmed by their own family memories that
they could not report on the state of the person they were representing, but
spoke about their own mother, for example. At this point I have no hesitation
to respectfully replace them with another participant.
Chuck Cogliandro
Family Constellations Facilitator
Brennan Healing Science Practitioner
Kumandi Drums & Healing
404-577-6842 voice mail
www.kumandi.com
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Top ^
2.2
Re: suffering from representatives
Wed Jan 29, 2014 1:16 am (PST) . Posted by:
"Robert Grant"
" If a representative begins to feel too much of their own unresolved
energies,"
Dear Chuck and All,
Thank you for being open to discuss this significant aspect of the
'classic" constellation approach. You are highlighting the very challenge
that besets many constellations.
"I've had representatives be so overwhelmed by their own family memories
that they could not report on the state of the person they were
representing, but spoke about their own mother, for example. At this point
I have no hesitation to respectfully replace them with another participant."
You see at that point the representative whose energies has been triggered
is essentially dismissed. The constellation does not turn its focus where
the energy is manifesting but follows a somewhat rigid, predetermined,
doctrinal course.
This rigidity bothers me. We may say that we respectfully replace the
representative, but is this truly respectful? More importantly is this
really helpful to the field? At this point are we not treating the
representative as a second class participant, reinforcing some old
paradigm? Are we not second guessing the outcome and disallowing the field
to unfold?
Best wishes to all,
Robert
On Tue, Jan 28, 2014 at 10:15 PM, Chuck Cogliandro <chuck@xxxxxxxxxxx>wrote:
Reply to sender . Reply to group . Reply via Web Post . All Messages (36) .
I have great respect for this group and really appreciate the
opportunity to share ideas and perspectives. When we give representatives
guidance we tell them some simple things: that's there's nothing for them
to do or think about, but be open, relax and breathe; that they may feel
nothing, which is fine; and we lead them in some silent statements to
themselves that they are not [their name], that they are [the person they
are representing], and that they are in service to the healing of the
client and the client's family. As facilitators we hold that as
the highest intention for the constellation- that everyone is serving the
client and the healing of that particular family system.
If a representative begins to feel too much of their own unresolved
energies, they will be less available to be open to the sensations,
impressions and most importantly the energies of the family member. It
takes a real practice of multi-dimensional awareness to hold the energies
of who you're representing, not lose your self in the representation, and
remember that you're serving the needs of the client and the process of the
constellation. I've had representatives be so overwhelmed by their own
family memories that they could not report on the state of the person they
were representing, but spoke about their own mother, for example. At this
point I have no hesitation to respectfully replace them with
another participant.
Chuck Cogliandro
Family Constellations Facilitator
Brennan Healing Science Practitioner
Kumandi Drums & Healing
404-577-6842 voice mail
www.kumandi.com
Top ^
2.3
Re: suffering from representatives
Wed Jan 29, 2014 2:58 am (PST) . Posted by:
"Joe pirone"
Moreno would say that there are multiple fields that emerge and that choosing
the proto agonist, the greatest sufferer is key to the process. One of the
limitations of the classic hellinger work
is that the followers can not see the intensity of the fields colors and as
such a less warmed up protagonist is chosen. To remedy this I would suggest
classic psychodramatic warm up techniques prior to the work of hellinger. He
did not need to do what most of us need to do as facilitators.
This might be an interesting new thread.Joseph pirone drjmpirone@xxxxxx
On Jan 29, 2014, at 4:16 AM, Robert Grant <erebees@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
" If a representative begins to feel too much of their own unresolved
energies,"
Dear Chuck and All,
Thank you for being open to discuss this significant aspect of the
'classic" constellation approach. You are highlighting the very challenge
that besets many constellations.
"I've had representatives be so overwhelmed by their own family memories
that they could not report on the state of the person they were
representing, but spoke about their own mother, for example. At this point
I have no hesitation to respectfully replace them with another participant."
You see at that point the representative whose energies has been triggered
is essentially dismissed. The constellation does not turn its focus where
the energy is manifesting but follows a somewhat rigid, predetermined,
doctrinal course.
This rigidity bothers me. We may say that we respectfully replace the
representative, but is this truly respectful? More importantly is this
really helpful to the field? At this point are we not treating the
representative as a second class participant, reinforcing some old
paradigm? Are we not second guessing the outcome and disallowing the field
to unfold?
Best wishes to all,
Robert
On Tue, Jan 28, 2014 at 10:15 PM, Chuck Cogliandro <chuck@xxxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
I have great respect for this group and really appreciate the opportunity
to share ideas and perspectives. When we give representatives guidance we
tell them some simple things: that's there's nothing for them to do or
think about, but be open, relax and breathe; that they may feel nothing,
which is fine; and we lead them in some silent statements to themselves
that they are not [their name], that they are [the person they are
representing], and that they are in service to the healing of the client
and the client's family. As facilitators we hold that as the highest
intention for the constellation- that everyone is serving the client and
the healing of that particular family system.
If a representative begins to feel too much of their own unresolved
energies, they will be less available to be open to the sensations,
impressions and most importantly the energies of the family member. It
takes a real practice of multi-dimensional awareness to hold the energies
of who you're representing, not lose your self in the representation, and
remember that you're serving the needs of the client and the process of the
constellation. I've had representatives be so overwhelmed by their own
family memories that they could not report on the state of the person they
were representing, but spoke about their own mother, for example. At this
point I have no hesitation to respectfully replace them with another
participant.
Chuck Cogliandro
Family Constellations Facilitator
Brennan Healing Science Practitioner
Kumandi Drums & Healing
404-577-6842 voice mail
www.kumandi.com
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Top ^
3a
Re: Digest Number 2409 Suffering from Representatives
Tue Jan 28, 2014 11:23 pm (PST) . Posted by:
"gary stuart" garystuart
Great thread∑
There really is no OTHER∑
I think that we all share one soul and are willing to support others in
need∑ what amazes me the most in ANY constellation is that more than ∏ of
the Rep‚s represent the Dead who come through as IF they are still living in
Real Time and Space with their granddaughter or grandsons who may be
working. It blows me away to this day. AND this is how I knew 17 years ago
I wanted to be a Constellation facilitator∑ Heaven and Earth are bridged
very Shamanically for these precious moments in the Eternal Timeline of
LIFE! One thing I feel is imperative is that the REP‚s for the Dead get
healing and resolution so the Positive Life force minus the negative
entanglement can be restored. I work as much for the Ancestor Reps as the
Client when they heal it‚s a back to the Future moment for the Client and
the Weight has transformed. Sometimes I feel Constellation Biz should have
a shingle of Masochists „R‰ US! My attendee‚s have been rep‚ing weekly for
3-8 years EVERY Sat. Night in LA∑ They have Grown and learned so much AND
feel we are healing Humanity∑ 1 family at a time∑.
So it‚s a Win-Win for ALL. The living , the dead and of course the client
and for me my heart and compassion and wisdom grow greater and stronger from
being allowed by the field to put it ALL into context with wisdom and LOVE∑.
Many, Many attendee‚s feel they were supposed to be present even if NOT
being a Rep AND they feel changed and actively engaged in the sidelines∑ I
see a LARGER self-organizing presence that pick the theme, people and issues
that are brought weekly∑ I‚m in service to it all with great love and
appreciation for the richness transformation of suffering brings∑..
Namaste Gary Stuart LA, CA Gary@xxxxxxxxxxxx updated website coming soon
www.chifield.com
From: ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] ;
Sent: Sunday, January 26, 2014 4:55 AM
To: ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [ConstellationTalk] Digest Number 2409
<http://groups.yahoo.com/;_ylc=X3oDMTJkbTg4ODhkBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzkwM
DgyODcEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDYyMjE1BHNlYwNmdHIEc2xrA2dmcARzdGltZQMxMzkwNzQwODkx>
Yahoo! Groups
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ConstellationTalk;_ylc=X3oDMTJkNXYzMHFyBF9TAz
k3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzkwMDgyODcEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDYyMjE1BHNlYwNoZHIEc2xrA2hwaA
RzdGltZQMxMzkwNzQwODkx> Constellation Talk Group
11 New Messages
Digest #2409
1a
Re: suffering from representatives by "Zaquie Meredith"
1b
Re: suffering from representatives by "sheila saunders" pazwthn
1c
Re: suffering from representatives by "Heiki Eesmaa" heiki_e
1d
FW: [ConstellationTalk] suffering from representatives by "Zaquie Meredith"
1e
Re: suffering from representatives by "Rosalba Stocco" rstocco@xxxxxxxxxx
1f
Re: suffering from representatives by "Dan Booth Cohen, PhD" bunnywhoo
1g
Re: suffering from representatives by "Katia del Rivero Vargas"
1h
Re: suffering from representatives by "Janice Crawford"
1i
Re: suffering from representatives by "Heiki Eesmaa" heiki_e
1j
Re: suffering from representatives by "Chris Walsh" constellationflow
2a
Re: Film Recommendation by "CK Lee"
Messages
1a
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ConstellationTalk/message/10131;_ylc=X3oDMTJy
OTd2cjlhBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzkwMDgyODcEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDYyMjE1BG1zZ0lk
AzEwMTMxBHNlYwNkbXNnBHNsawN2bXNnBHN0aW1lAzEzOTA3NDA4OTE-> Re: suffering from
representatives
Sat Jan 25, 2014 5:17 am (PST) . Posted by:
<mailto:zaquie@xxxxxxxxxx?subject=Re%3A%20suffering%20from%20representatives
"Zaquie Meredith"
Obviously, the representatives get more than anybody else when they
represent.
This makes them open their field to experience situations and things that
they never did before.
It is just magic. They get so much. It is not a sacrifice. It is a growth.
Zaquie C Meredith, São Paulo, Brazil
Socióloga, Consteladora e Psicoterapeuta
http://www.zaquie.com/
Autora dos Livros: "O Que Você Precisa Saber” / “A Consciência das Sensações
e Constelações” / “É a Fé que sustenta o Pássaro”
Linkedin: http://br.linkedin.com/in/zaquie
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/zaquie.meredith
Twitter: http://twitter.com/zaquiemeredith
From: Chris Walsh <chris@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Reply-To: <ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2014 19:36:30 +0800
To: <ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [ConstellationTalk] suffering from representatives
Hi Maria
I would tell him to go around asking the people who represented during the
break.
Cheers
Chris Walsh
Melbourne, Australia
ph +61 (0)3 9487 4647
www.cwalsh.com.au <http://www.cwalsh.com.au>
On Sat, Jan 25, 2014 at 6:47 PM, Maria Goossens <goossens.maria@xxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
constellation
Hi,
One of my patients looked from the outside of the circle to a
and wondered why representatives offer themselves to go through the painof
another patient. I couldn't give a right answer. Six days later he repeats
this same question. Again, I wasn't able to answer correctly.
Has anyone an answer on this question ?
Thanks,
Mieke
Maria Goossens, MD
www.dokter-goossens.be <http://www.dokter-goossens.be>
goossens.maria@xxxxxxxxxx
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
<mailto:zaquie@xxxxxxxxxx?subject=Re%3A%20suffering%20from%20representatives
Reply to sender .<mailto:ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=Re%3A%20suffering%20from%2
0representatives>; Reply to group .
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F9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzkwMDgyODcEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDYyMjE1BG1zZ0lkAzEwMTMxB
HNlYwNkbXNnBHNsawNycGx5BHN0aW1lAzEzOTA3NDA4OTE-?act=reply&messageNum=10131>
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All Messages (15) . Top ^
1b
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ConstellationTalk/message/10133;_ylc=X3oDMTJy
OGFpNmI4BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzkwMDgyODcEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDYyMjE1BG1zZ0lk
AzEwMTMzBHNlYwNkbXNnBHNsawN2bXNnBHN0aW1lAzEzOTA3NDA4OTE-> Re: suffering from
representatives
Sat Jan 25, 2014 6:38 am (PST) . Posted by:
<mailto:peacefulcentre@xxxxxxxxxxx?subject=Re%3A%20suffering%20from%20repres
entatives> "sheila saunders" pazwthn
My experience as a rep has brought me tremendous insight into the patterns
that run in my family and also have given me tremendous empathy towards the
experiences that others share, both in my work as a therapist and also in
life in general. The incredible process of engaging in the thoughts and
feelings of someone whose actual experience I never had in my own life, is a
remarkable way of walking in another's shoes. I feel as though I can
understand so many more events than I have experienced myself, having stood
in the place of those who went through them. Of all ages, of both genders,
several races, as well as more inanimate things.
Also, the process of watching 2 tracts run in my mind and body quite
fascinates me, as I learn to leave one tract and pay attention to the other.
If I could be a professional representative, I'd do it!!
thanks, sheila
Sent from my iPad
On Jan 25, 2014, at 5:47, "Maria Goossens" <goossens.maria@xxxxxxxxxx>wrote:
constellation and wondered why representatives offer themselves to go
Hi,
One of my patients looked from the outside of the circle to a
through the pain of another patient. I couldn't give a right answer. Six
days later he repeats this same question. Again, I wasn't able to answer
correctly.
Has anyone an answer on this question ?
Thanks,
Mieke
Maria Goossens, MD
www.dokter-goossens.be
goossens.maria@xxxxxxxxxx
<mailto:peacefulcentre@xxxxxxxxxxx?subject=Re%3A%20suffering%20from%20repres
entatives> Reply to sender .
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HNlYwNkbXNnBHNsawNycGx5BHN0aW1lAzEzOTA3NDA4OTE-?act=reply&messageNum=10133>
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1c
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ConstellationTalk/message/10134;_ylc=X3oDMTJy
aHFuMjhpBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzkwMDgyODcEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDYyMjE1BG1zZ0lk
AzEwMTM0BHNlYwNkbXNnBHNsawN2bXNnBHN0aW1lAzEzOTA3NDA4OTE-> Re: suffering from
representatives
Sat Jan 25, 2014 6:39 am (PST) . Posted by:
<mailto:heiki.eesmaa@xxxxxxxxx?subject=Re%3A%20suffering%20from%20representa
tives> "Heiki Eesmaa" heiki_e
Being a representative is a very interesting experience, the pain and
emotion lived through is temporary (well, it might take time to stabilize
or work through some of your own material that gets restimulated, but thats
another story).
The question in that sense is much like why would people watch a horror
movie or a love story instead of living it through.
all the best
Heiki
On Sat, Jan 25, 2014 at 12:47 PM, Maria Goossens
<goossens.maria@xxxxxxxxxx>wrote:
Hi,
One of my patients looked from the outside of the circle to a
constellation and wondered why representatives offer themselves to go
through the pain of another patient. I couldn't give a right answer. Six
days later he repeats this same question. Again, I wasn't able to answer
correctly.
Has anyone an answer on this question ?
Thanks,
Mieke
Maria Goossens, MD
www.dokter-goossens.be
goossens.maria@xxxxxxxxxx
<mailto:heiki.eesmaa@xxxxxxxxx?subject=Re%3A%20suffering%20from%20representa
tives> Reply to sender .
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0representatives>; Reply to group .
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ConstellationTalk/post;_ylc=X3oDMTJyZjhrNXRuB
F9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzkwMDgyODcEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDYyMjE1BG1zZ0lkAzEwMTM0B
HNlYwNkbXNnBHNsawNycGx5BHN0aW1lAzEzOTA3NDA4OTE-?act=reply&messageNum=10134>
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1d
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ConstellationTalk/message/10135;_ylc=X3oDMTJy
MmYwb3R2BF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzkwMDgyODcEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDYyMjE1BG1zZ0lk
AzEwMTM1BHNlYwNkbXNnBHNsawN2bXNnBHN0aW1lAzEzOTA3NDA4OTE-> FW:
[ConstellationTalk] suffering from representatives
Sat Jan 25, 2014 9:34 am (PST) . Posted by:
<mailto:zaquie@xxxxxxxxxx?subject=Re%3A%20FW%3A%20%5BConstellationTalk%5D%20
suffering%20from%20representatives> "Zaquie Meredith"
Obviously, the representatives get more than anybody else when they
represent.
This makes them open their field to experience situations and things that
they never did before.
It is just magic. They get so much. It is not a sacrifice. It is a growth.
Zaquie C Meredith, São Paulo, Brazil
From: Chris Walsh <chris@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Reply-To: <ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2014 19:36:30 +0800
To: <ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [ConstellationTalk] suffering from representatives
Hi Maria
I would tell him to go around asking the people who represented during the
break.
Cheers
Chris Walsh
Melbourne, Australia
ph +61 (0)3 9487 4647
www.cwalsh.com.au <http://www.cwalsh.com.au>
On Sat, Jan 25, 2014 at 6:47 PM, Maria Goossens <goossens.maria@xxxxxxxxxx>
wrote:
constellation
Hi,
One of my patients looked from the outside of the circle to a
and wondered why representatives offer themselves to go through the painof
another patient. I couldn't give a right answer. Six days later he repeats
this same question. Again, I wasn't able to answer correctly.
Has anyone an answer on this question ?
Thanks,
Mieke
Maria Goossens, MD
www.dokter-goossens.be <http://www.dokter-goossens.be>
goossens.maria@xxxxxxxxxx
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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suffering%20from%20representatives> Reply to sender .
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lationTalk%5D%20suffering%20from%20representatives> Reply to group .
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1e
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ConstellationTalk/message/10136;_ylc=X3oDMTJy
Nmx1bzlvBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzkwMDgyODcEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDYyMjE1BG1zZ0lk
AzEwMTM2BHNlYwNkbXNnBHNsawN2bXNnBHN0aW1lAzEzOTA3NDA4OTE-> Re: suffering from
representatives
Sat Jan 25, 2014 9:54 am (PST) . Posted by:
<mailto:rstocco@xxxxxxxxxx?subject=Re%3A%20suffering%20from%20representative
s> "Rosalba Stocco" rstocco@xxxxxxxxxx
I receive the greatest insights when representing because it is no longer an
intellectual exercise. The learning is embodied. Representing is a beautiful
gift. Representing allows for reciprocity, my body may be of service to
another family field, and yet as I gain insight at the physical, emotional
and spiritual level, so too my family field.
Rosalba
http://podroom.a2zen.fm/media?q=ancestral+roots
http://guelphfamilyconstellations.com/ ;
Rosalba Stocco, MSW, RSW,
SE Practitioner
rstocco@xxxxxx
34 Neeve Street
Guelph, ON
N1H 4C1
519 827 0528
On Jan 25, 2014, at 12:29 PM, Zaquie Meredith <zaquie@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
<goossens.maria@xxxxxxxxxx>
Obviously, the representatives get more than anybody else when they
represent.
This makes them open their field to experience situations and things that
they never did before.
It is just magic. They get so much. It is not a sacrifice. It is a growth.
Zaquie C Meredith, São Paulo, Brazil
From: Chris Walsh <chris@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Reply-To: <ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2014 19:36:30 +0800
To: <ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: Re: [ConstellationTalk] suffering from representatives
Hi Maria
I would tell him to go around asking the people who represented during the
break.
Cheers
Chris Walsh
Melbourne, Australia
ph +61 (0)3 9487 4647
www.cwalsh.com.au <http://www.cwalsh.com.au>
On Sat, Jan 25, 2014 at 6:47 PM, Maria Goossens
wrote:constellation
Hi,
One of my patients looked from the outside of the circle to a
ofand wondered why representatives offer themselves to go through the pain
repeatsanother patient. I couldn't give a right answer. Six days later he
this same question. Again, I wasn't able to answer correctly.
Has anyone an answer on this question ?
Thanks,
Mieke
Maria Goossens, MD
www.dokter-goossens.be <http://www.dokter-goossens.be>
goossens.maria@xxxxxxxxxx
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
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s> Reply to sender .
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Reply via Web Post .
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1f
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ConstellationTalk/message/10137;_ylc=X3oDMTJy
c2psZHRnBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzkwMDgyODcEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDYyMjE1BG1zZ0lk
AzEwMTM3BHNlYwNkbXNnBHNsawN2bXNnBHN0aW1lAzEzOTA3NDA4OTE-> Re: suffering from
representatives
Sat Jan 25, 2014 10:04 am (PST) . Posted by:
<mailto:danboothcohen@xxxxxxxxx?subject=Re%3A%20suffering%20from%20represent
atives> "Dan Booth Cohen, PhD" bunnywhoo
Dear Meike -
In my experience, very few people are willing to offer themselves to go
through the pain of another person. I agree with the responses you received,
especially Sheila's and Zaquie's. That is why I am always willing to
represent. However, for most people, it is not something they want to do.
For me, a good day is when I can stand as a women's sexually abusive
grandfather, then as another women's kidney disease, and finally represent a
man whose children won't speak to him. It heals and enriches me. .And, it's
not to everyone's taste.
When I was in Norway this fall, I worked with a group of older men with
prostate cancer. The concept of standing in representation and allowing
another man's hidden family soul to fill their awareness was entirely
foreign to them. They found the suggestion inappropriate and distasteful.
Who is this crazy doctor from America and what he is asking us to do?
The answer I have found is that very few people want to offer themselves in
this way. This is why I prefer to do personal Constellations in a 2-way or
3-way format. When I work with groups, my preference is that those who
attend are coming for a group experience built on ceremony and conceptual
Constellations.
Dan
From: ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Maria Goossens
Sent: Saturday, January 25, 2014 5:47 AM
To: constellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [ConstellationTalk] suffering from representatives
Hi,
One of my patients looked from the outside of the circle to a constellation
and wondered why representatives offer themselves to go through the pain of
another patient. I couldn't give a right answer. Six days later he repeats
this same question. Again, I wasn't able to answer correctly.
Has anyone an answer on this question ?
Thanks,
Mieke
Maria Goossens, MD
www.dokter-goossens.be
goossens.maria@xxxxxxxxxx
<mailto:danboothcohen@xxxxxxxxx?subject=Re%3A%20suffering%20from%20represent
atives> Reply to sender .
<mailto:ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=Re%3A%20suffering%20from%2
0representatives>; Reply to group .
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ConstellationTalk/post;_ylc=X3oDMTJycGI0cGdyB
F9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzkwMDgyODcEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDYyMjE1BG1zZ0lkAzEwMTM3B
HNlYwNkbXNnBHNsawNycGx5BHN0aW1lAzEzOTA3NDA4OTE-?act=reply&messageNum=10137>
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1g
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ConstellationTalk/message/10138;_ylc=X3oDMTJy
cTB2YTdvBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzkwMDgyODcEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDYyMjE1BG1zZ0lk
AzEwMTM4BHNlYwNkbXNnBHNsawN2bXNnBHN0aW1lAzEzOTA3NDA4OTE-> Re: suffering from
representatives
Sat Jan 25, 2014 12:25 pm (PST) . Posted by:
<mailto:katia@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=Re%3A%20suffering%20from%20represe
ntatives> "Katia del Rivero Vargas"
I feel identified with the question of your client. In fact I don't know why
the people do this.
In the better option I only could share why I do.
1. Because I learned to love what for me was so hard to love
representing this elements (in my case people who killed, abandon, abuse,
etc.)
2. Because some of the deeply insights in my life I found during I
represented others and theirs histories.
3. Because I felt the pain and I could felt the healing.
4. Because I learned that all of us are connected and are the same, no
better no worst.
5. And I could go on for hours... this are only some, could be the
main.
And I'll go more... why your client ask this? What could happen in you not
answer and only explore with she/he, her/his own answers?
¿For what you believe that this happen?
Imagine that you do that.. What is your idea because this happen?
¿Why you (if she/he offer her/himself as representative) do that?
Hope serve to you. Could be a different approach.
Katia del Rivero Vargas
Visión Sistémica
Directora General
Oficina (52 55) 5544 8799 ˆ 5243 0263 / Celular (044 55) 5454 5438
<mailto:kdelrivero@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> katia@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx / skype:
kdelrivero
PPor favor, Ayúdenos a Proteger & Sanar Nuestro Medio Ambiente y sus
Recursos Naturales mediante el Reciclado y Reducción del Uso
Aviso de Privacidad Simplificado
Le informamos que sus datos personales pueden ser obtenidos mediante medios
electrónicos remotos como correo electrónico y/o vía telefónica, sus datos
serán para las finalidades previstas en el aviso de privacidad, las cuales
incluyen facturación y obligaciones contraídas con nuestros clientes del
Instituto de Pensamiento Sistémico, con domicilio en Sur 67-A número 142,
Colonia el Prado, México, D.F. Para mayor información acerca del tratamiento
y derechos, usted puede acceder al aviso de privacidad integral en las
instalaciones de la empresa y/o solicitarlo vía electrónica a la dirección
<mailto:info@xxxxxxxxxx> info@xxxxxxxxxx además mediante este mismo medio
puede manifestar su negativa al uso de sus datos personales dentro de los
plazos establecidos en el Reglamento de la Ley Federal de Protección de
Datos en Posesión de los Particulares o limitar el uso o divulgación de sus
datos, indicando mediante correo electrónico que desea dejar de recibir
correos electrónicos promocionales.
De: ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] En nombre de Maria Goossens
Enviado el: sábado, 25 de enero de 2014 04:47 a.m.
Para: constellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
Asunto: [ConstellationTalk] suffering from representatives
Hi,
One of my patients looked from the outside of the circle to a constellation
and wondered why representatives offer themselves to go through the pain of
another patient. I couldn't give a right answer. Six days later he repeats
this same question. Again, I wasn't able to answer correctly.
Has anyone an answer on this question ?
Thanks,
Mieke
Maria Goossens, MD
<http://www.dokter-goossens.be> www.dokter-goossens.be
<mailto:goossens.maria@xxxxxxxxxx> goossens.maria@xxxxxxxxxx
<mailto:katia@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=Re%3A%20suffering%20from%20represe
ntatives> Reply to sender .
<mailto:ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=Re%3A%20suffering%20from%2
0representatives>; Reply to group .
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ConstellationTalk/post;_ylc=X3oDMTJybHZxY2VkB
F9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzkwMDgyODcEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDYyMjE1BG1zZ0lkAzEwMTM4B
HNlYwNkbXNnBHNsawNycGx5BHN0aW1lAzEzOTA3NDA4OTE-?act=reply&messageNum=10138>
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<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ConstellationTalk/message/10126;_ylc=X3oDMTM3
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1h
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ConstellationTalk/message/10139;_ylc=X3oDMTJy
YjkzczgwBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzkwMDgyODcEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDYyMjE1BG1zZ0lk
AzEwMTM5BHNlYwNkbXNnBHNsawN2bXNnBHN0aW1lAzEzOTA3NDA4OTE-> Re: suffering from
representatives
Sat Jan 25, 2014 12:49 pm (PST) . Posted by:
<mailto:jcrawford4000@xxxxxxxxx?subject=Re%3A%20suffering%20from%20represent
atives> "Janice Crawford"
I particularly liked Chris's suggestion. And in terms of anything
additional, it of course so much depends on what one sensed as a possible
form of defense against natural movements of love and service within this
person. For example, I wonder whether this client is someone with whom one
might go a bit scientific/logical? Perhaps speaking generally to those in
the group who might be having difficulty with understanding
representing (vs. focused on him) about empathy to both pain and pleasure
being a naturally occurring quality in infants - motor neurons, etc.,- that
is too often injured by adulthood in many of us. One might then gently
question whether it would it be worth it to feel some temporary discomfort
as a representative if it also helps us more pleasurably feel our own and
others joy?
All the best from my igloo in New York City,
Jan Crawford
On Sat, Jan 25, 2014 at 1:04 PM, Dan Booth Cohen, PhD <
danboothcohen@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
willing
Dear Meike ˆ
In my experience, very few people are willing to offer themselves to go
through the pain of another person. I agree with the responses you
received, especially Sheila‚s and Zaquie‚s. That is why I am always
to represent. However, for most people, it is not something they want to
do. For me, a good day is when I can stand as a women‚s sexually abusive
grandfather, then as another women‚s kidney disease, and finally represent
a man whose children won‚t speak to him. It heals and enriches me. ∑And,
it‚s not to everyone‚s taste.
When I was in Norway this fall, I worked with a group of older men with
prostate cancer. The concept of standing in representation and allowing
another man‚s hidden family soul to fill their awareness was entirely
foreign to them. They found the suggestion inappropriate and distasteful.
Who is this crazy doctor from America and what he is asking us to do?
The answer I have found is that very few people want to offer themselves
in this way. This is why I prefer to do personal Constellations in a 2-way
or 3-way format. When I work with groups, my preference is that those who
attend are coming for a group experience built on ceremony and conceptual
Constellations.
Dan
*From:* ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:
ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] *On Behalf Of *Maria Goossens
*Sent:* Saturday, January 25, 2014 5:47 AM
*To:* constellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
*Subject:* [ConstellationTalk] suffering from representatives
Hi,
One of my patients looked from the outside of the circle to a
constellation and wondered why representatives offer themselves to go
through the pain of another patient. I couldn't give a right answer. Six
days later he repeats this same question. Again, I wasn't able to answer
correctly.
Has anyone an answer on this question ?
Thanks,
Mieke
Maria Goossens, MD
www.dokter-goossens.be
goossens.maria@xxxxxxxxxx
<mailto:jcrawford4000@xxxxxxxxx?subject=Re%3A%20suffering%20from%20represent
atives> Reply to sender .
<mailto:ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=Re%3A%20suffering%20from%2
0representatives>; Reply to group .
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ConstellationTalk/post;_ylc=X3oDMTJyY3NkbGF0B
F9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzkwMDgyODcEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDYyMjE1BG1zZ0lkAzEwMTM5B
HNlYwNkbXNnBHNsawNycGx5BHN0aW1lAzEzOTA3NDA4OTE-?act=reply&messageNum=10139>
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<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ConstellationTalk/message/10126;_ylc=X3oDMTM3
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1i
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ConstellationTalk/message/10140;_ylc=X3oDMTJy
cm5vbzJkBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzkwMDgyODcEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDYyMjE1BG1zZ0lk
AzEwMTQwBHNlYwNkbXNnBHNsawN2bXNnBHN0aW1lAzEzOTA3NDA4OTE-> Re: suffering from
representatives
Sat Jan 25, 2014 11:46 pm (PST) . Posted by:
<mailto:heiki.eesmaa@xxxxxxxxx?subject=Re%3A%20suffering%20from%20representa
tives> "Heiki Eesmaa" heiki_e
Very interesting thread! I didn't even realize so many people had some
adversity towards representing, somehow it hasn't ever been a problem.
Even contrary to adversity, much of the times even people without training
in energy work experience strong vital energy movements. Movements of the
Soul can be quite similar to Spontaneous Movement Qigong.
all the best
Heiki
On Sat, Jan 25, 2014 at 10:48 PM, Janice Crawford
<jcrawford4000@xxxxxxxxx>wrote:
that
I particularly liked Chris's suggestion. And in terms of anything
additional, it of course so much depends on what one sensed as a possible
form of defense against natural movements of love and service within this
person. For example, I wonder whether this client is someone with whom one
might go a bit scientific/logical? Perhaps speaking generally to those in
the group who might be having difficulty with understanding
representing (vs. focused on him) about empathy to both pain and pleasure
being a naturally occurring quality in infants - motor neurons, etc.,-
is too often injured by adulthood in many of us. One might then gentlywilling
question whether it would it be worth it to feel some temporary discomfort
as a representative if it also helps us more pleasurably feel our own and
others joy?
All the best from my igloo in New York City,
Jan Crawford
On Sat, Jan 25, 2014 at 1:04 PM, Dan Booth Cohen, PhD <
danboothcohen@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Dear Meike ˆ
In my experience, very few people are willing to offer themselves to go
through the pain of another person. I agree with the responses you
received, especially Sheila‚s and Zaquie‚s. That is why I am always
representto represent. However, for most people, it is not something they want to
do. For me, a good day is when I can stand as a women‚s sexually abusive
grandfather, then as another women‚s kidney disease, and finally
2-waya man whose children won‚t speak to him. It heals and enriches me. ∑And,
it‚s not to everyone‚s taste.
When I was in Norway this fall, I worked with a group of older men with
prostate cancer. The concept of standing in representation and allowing
another man‚s hidden family soul to fill their awareness was entirely
foreign to them. They found the suggestion inappropriate and distasteful.
Who is this crazy doctor from America and what he is asking us to do?
The answer I have found is that very few people want to offer themselves
in this way. This is why I prefer to do personal Constellations in a
or 3-way format. When I work with groups, my preference is that those who
attend are coming for a group experience built on ceremony and conceptual
Constellations.
Dan
*From:* ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:
ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] *On Behalf Of *Maria Goossens
*Sent:* Saturday, January 25, 2014 5:47 AM
*To:* constellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
*Subject:* [ConstellationTalk] suffering from representatives
Hi,
One of my patients looked from the outside of the circle to a
constellation and wondered why representatives offer themselves to go
through the pain of another patient. I couldn't give a right answer. Six
days later he repeats this same question. Again, I wasn't able to answer
correctly.
Has anyone an answer on this question ?
Thanks,
Mieke
Maria Goossens, MD
www.dokter-goossens.be
goossens.maria@xxxxxxxxxx
<mailto:heiki.eesmaa@xxxxxxxxx?subject=Re%3A%20suffering%20from%20representa
tives> Reply to sender .
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1j
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ConstellationTalk/message/10141;_ylc=X3oDMTJy
ajJiNDMwBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzkwMDgyODcEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDYyMjE1BG1zZ0lk
AzEwMTQxBHNlYwNkbXNnBHNsawN2bXNnBHN0aW1lAzEzOTA3NDA4OTE-> Re: suffering from
representatives
Sun Jan 26, 2014 4:30 am (PST) . Posted by:
<mailto:chris@xxxxxxxxxxxxx?subject=Re%3A%20suffering%20from%20representativ
es> "Chris Walsh" constellationflow
I agree Heike,
In my workshops & all the workshops and trainings I have attended, the
majority of people are actually keen to represent. While I believe the
reluctance and fear does exist, I also think it has been overstated in some
of the posts over the last few days
Cheers
Chris Walsh
Melbourne, Australia
ph +61 (0)3 9487 4647
www.cwalsh.com.au
On Sun, Jan 26, 2014 at 6:46 PM, Heiki Eesmaa <heiki.eesmaa@xxxxxxxxx>wrote:
<mailto:jcrawford4000@xxxxxxxxx%0b>
Very interesting thread! I didn't even realize so many people had some
adversity towards representing, somehow it hasn't ever been a problem.
Even contrary to adversity, much of the times even people without training
in energy work experience strong vital energy movements. Movements of the
Soul can be quite similar to Spontaneous Movement Qigong.
all the best
Heiki
On Sat, Jan 25, 2014 at 10:48 PM, Janice Crawford <jcrawford4000@xxxxxxxxx
onewrote:
I particularly liked Chris's suggestion. And in terms of anything
additional, it of course so much depends on what one sensed as a possible
form of defense against natural movements of love and service within this
person. For example, I wonder whether this client is someone with whom
thatmight go a bit scientific/logical? Perhaps speaking generally to those in
the group who might be having difficulty with understanding
representing (vs. focused on him) about empathy to both pain and pleasure
being a naturally occurring quality in infants - motor neurons, etc.,-
discomfortis too often injured by adulthood in many of us. One might then gently
question whether it would it be worth it to feel some temporary
willingas a representative if it also helps us more pleasurably feel our own and
others joy?
All the best from my igloo in New York City,
Jan Crawford
On Sat, Jan 25, 2014 at 1:04 PM, Dan Booth Cohen, PhD <
danboothcohen@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Dear Meike ˆ
In my experience, very few people are willing to offer themselves to go
through the pain of another person. I agree with the responses you
received, especially Sheila‚s and Zaquie‚s. That is why I am always
representto represent. However, for most people, it is not something they want to
do. For me, a good day is when I can stand as a women‚s sexually abusive
grandfather, then as another women‚s kidney disease, and finally
distasteful.a man whose children won‚t speak to him. It heals and enriches me. ∑And,
it‚s not to everyone‚s taste.
When I was in Norway this fall, I worked with a group of older men with
prostate cancer. The concept of standing in representation and allowing
another man‚s hidden family soul to fill their awareness was entirely
foreign to them. They found the suggestion inappropriate and
2-wayWho is this crazy doctor from America and what he is asking us to do?
The answer I have found is that very few people want to offer themselves
in this way. This is why I prefer to do personal Constellations in a
whoor 3-way format. When I work with groups, my preference is that those
conceptualattend are coming for a group experience built on ceremony and
Constellations.
Dan
*From:* ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:
ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] *On Behalf Of *Maria Goossens
*Sent:* Saturday, January 25, 2014 5:47 AM
*To:* constellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
*Subject:* [ConstellationTalk] suffering from representatives
Hi,
One of my patients looked from the outside of the circle to a
constellation and wondered why representatives offer themselves to go
through the pain of another patient. I couldn't give a right answer. Six
days later he repeats this same question. Again, I wasn't able to answer
correctly.
Has anyone an answer on this question ?
Thanks,
Mieke
Maria Goossens, MD
www.dokter-goossens.be
goossens.maria@xxxxxxxxxx
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2a
<http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ConstellationTalk/message/10132;_ylc=X3oDMTJy
cWd2MmkxBF9TAzk3MzU5NzE1BGdycElkAzkwMDgyODcEZ3Jwc3BJZAMxNzA1MDYyMjE1BG1zZ0lk
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Recommendation
Sat Jan 25, 2014 5:55 am (PST) . Posted by:
<mailto:kingslee123@xxxxxxxxxxx?subject=Re%3A%20Film%20Recommendation> "CK
Lee"
Dear Liz,
Thanks for the film recommendation of Les incendies. Unfortunately I could
only find the trailer to this film and not the whole film on youtube.
I hope you can post the whole film on youtube for the benefit of those like
me who cannot find this film in our country.
Many thanks.
Regards,CK Lee
To: ConstellationTalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
From: liz.sleeper@xxxxxxxxx
Date: Sat, 25 Jan 2014 07:10:13 +0000
Subject: [ConstellationTalk] Film Recommendation
Hi all,
I just want to recommend a film that I saw last night: "Les Incendies", it's
a Canadian film about two young middle eastern people discovering their
roots.
It is truly a film about accepting your life at the price your family has
paid for it.
I very much recommend it.
Love Liz
Liz Sleeper
Tel Direct 01273 476087
Mobile: 07786 518 736
Sussex Constellations: find out more
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