I am going to have to admit that I did not read this particular post
from Mustafa, but I am still awaiting an answer from him. He claimed
that there was a god because it was logical, that anything that is
created must have a creator. I formalized his claim of logic in the
syllogism that all things that are created must have a creator; the
universe is created; therefore the universe has a creator. I pointed out
that logic is an information processing algorithm that works just as
well with false information as it does with true information and I
suggested that his logic fails because it begins with some very
questionable premises. I asked for some evidence that the universe was
created. Mustafa then committed another logical fallacy, the fallacy of
tautology. He said that anything that is made must have a maker. Well,
restating the assertion with different words that mean the same thing
does not make the assertion true. I asked for the evidence that the
universe had been made. He has still not answered me. If he does not
have an answer I think the proper thing to do is to admit it and then
agree with me that no one knows what caused the universe to exist. To
simply ignore the question, though, is intellectual dishonesty.
On 9/4/2017 11:40 AM, Carl Jarvis wrote:
Good Monday Morning, Bob.
Well, I wonder if you will follow my ramble to its conclusion, because
I am about to be quite critical of your lack of reason.
Remember, this is my observations, and not an attack on you, Bob. The
little I think I know about you is what you have chosen to share
on-line. And, unlike your snide put down of me, I do not intend this
to be a retaliation. It is simply a disagreement between two people.
It is my personal opinion that you have chosen to live in a "Make
Believe" world.
In that sense, your World is different from other "Make Believe
Worlds" only in the names you assign to your Make Believe Gods. But
the rhetoric is the same. Anger! Hatred! Contempt! Superiority!
Self Righteousness! The language is always directed to the belief
that you, and you alone, possess the "Truth Everlasting"! And each of
you, you pretenders of a Make Believe World where your Gods are
supreme, profess to "Love" your fellow Man. And you all shed
crocodile tears over the failure of all others to embrace your one
true Faith.
Allah and God and all the other invisible Deities, have the same very
human emotions. They all profess love, while striking down anyone who
opposes them. How God allows Satan to rule the Earth is only made
clear when viewed in Human Emotions rather than some unexplained
Higher Wisdom.
You point to Harvey as an example of Allah's wrath upon non believers.
What do you say about Allah's treatment of those suffering Muslims,
being battered by God's Drones? And what of the flooding, and the
horrific heat waves, and the starvation, and the weak cries of little
Muslim children, looking for their long dead parents? How long are we
Humans going to hang onto our "Make Believe" Beliefs? When do we wake
up and realize that this God/Allah thing is not working so well for
most Humans. Only a few people are benefiting from turning one
imaginary God against another. And those who benefit do not belong to
any of the Gods, even if they pretend to. They are the Evil Ones,
committed to manipulating the Masses, turning them against one another
in order to continue living their extravagant lives.
And you, Bob, are one of those people mindlessly feeding the Eternal
Fires of Hell...if such a place exists. But at least you are
participating in undermining any chance of Human Beings coming
together and learning to live as One People.
The creation of Gods answered many questions of early Man. Today, and
for many centuries, these Gods have been used to block the Masses from
living in comfort, safety and Peace.
In your Make Believe World, your Allah takes up His armies and turns
them toward defeating God. God has sworn, for generations, to beat
back the Muslim Hordes that once threatened to sweep across Europe,
which seems to have been the Real Promised Land.
Why must we all march to the tune of the Pied Pipers of the invisible
Gods? Why can't we look inside to our own strength and wisdom, passed
down to us from the beginning of Man? We do not need to know where we
first became Man. It is enough to know that you and I, and every
living person today, comes from a long chain of successes, unbroken,
making each of us a "perfect" Being? We do not to pretend any longer.
We have had the wisdom all along, and do not need to be lied to by our
Masters. We are not Allah's or God's children. We are the children
of our Ancestors. Our Spirit is that which is in All Humans. We are
all part of One. One Universe. All energy is part of each of us.
You are no better than my sister. I am no better than your father.
And none of us appear wise enough to treat this planet with respect.
If we are where we are, due to our following one invisible God or
another, we are following a bunch of losers! In fact, if I were a God
fearing man, I'd say that God, Allah and all other invisible Beings,
have abandoned this Planet, and gone fishing...together.
Finally, you and I do share something in common, Bob. We each believe
that the other one of us is misguided. Speaking only for myself, I do
not believe that by being wrong in your thinking, that you are somehow
less than me, or in league with the Evil One. We simply disagree.
Time will tell which of us, if either, is closest to being right.
Best of life to you, Bob.
Carl Jarvis
On 9/4/17, Bob <ebob824@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
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