I am aware of the difference between rational evidence and empirical
evidence. I am aware that so-called rational evidence is an oxymoron.
Any liar, any charlatan, any drug addled moron can say something and
that counts as rational evidence. Rational evidence is not rational at
all. If you want to rely on rational evidence then I can give you
plenty. All I have to do is to tell you something without anything at
all to back it up and that is so-called rational evidence. Empirical
evidence, on the other hand, is reality. If I place a nail on a piece of
wood and strike it with a hammer and the nail penetrates the wood and I
tell someone about it and they do the same thing and the nail penetrates
the wood too and if a thousand people try the same experiment and it
works the same every time then that is empirical evidence. If I told you
that I put a nail against a piece of wood and struck it with a hammer
and the nail turned into a petunia then that is so-called rational
evidence. Anyone who accepts so-called rational evidence over empirical
evidence is a hypocrite for telling someone else that he has a low I. Q.
But that is completely irrelevant to what I was trying to get you to
address. You flat out used a conclusion to arrive at a conclusion. You
claimed that the existence of something proves that it has a creator
without independent evidence of a creator. And, yes, I mean empirical
evidence because that is evidence of the real. Anyone can tell you that
the creator exists and if anyone did tell you that it would count as
so-called rational evidence, but it would still be irrational. But
circular reasoning is a logical fallacy. Now, you tell me how you can
possibly think that circular reasoning can somehow be logical. As for
your request that I not talk to you again about this subject, you are
being a hypocrite again. You impose your religion on everyone. No matter
how unwelcome it is you just keep imposing it and pestering people with
it. Okay, I can give as good as I get. If you want me to stop talking
matters of religion to you then you will have to stop talking matters of
religion to me. That means that you will have to avoid even posting a
religious message anywhere I can see it. Because if you do you should
expect that I will respond to it. And don't think you can necessarily
avoid that by unsubscribing from the Blind Democracy list. You search
the Internet for people to pester. You gather email addresses to spam
with religious nonsense. I expect that if I met you in person you would
follow me around preaching unwelcome rants at me like so many Christians
have done to me. You have no room to complain if someone does the same
to you. If you are going to be an unwelcome pest then you might expect
that someone just might be an unwelcome pest right back at you. And, by
the way, yes, my neighbor did die. He was a church goer. I wish I could
say that he found out that he was wrong about what comes next, but by
dying he found out nothing. He returned to the condition he was in a
thousand years ago, nonexistence of his consciousness.
_________________________________________________________________
J.K. Rowling
“ I mean, you could claim that anything's real if the only basis for believing
in it is that nobody's proved it doesn't exist! ”
― J.K. Rowling
On 12/3/2018 3:01 PM, Mostafa Almahdy wrote:
Roger, I insulted no one's intelligence. Perhaps your low IQ didn't
understand what's the difference between empirical and rational
evidence. That's not my problem. Go and find a solution for yourself.
I do not want to enter with you in a useless debate. You just hate
religion, fine, and that's just you and who you are and perhaps, some
bunch of Atheists, the world doesn't care about them. Ah, how is your
neighbor? Did he die? Don't worry, death will be your ultimate
destiny. There, you could be as loud in your disbelief as you are now.
Don't talk to me about this subject again. It's a vicious cycle.
Alright alright, I have been defeated and you are the most
intelligent, person, no no, you are the most intelligent creature.
What a Petulant
guy.
On 12/2/18, Roger Loran Bailey <rogerbailey81@xxxxxxx> wrote:
Mostafa, you falsely claim that you answered my question. You did not!
You ignored it and spouted more religious obfuscation. The question
concerned circular reasoning. You claim that the existence of something
shows the existence of its creator without independent evidence for the
creator. That is assuming the conclusion to reach the conclusion and it
is a complete logical fallacy. I asked you to address that logical
fallacy and you did not. Want to try again? And by the way, not only do
you insult my intelligence by expecting me to accept such a logical
fallacy as logic, but you insult your own intelligence by accepting it
as logic. Don't you have enough self respect to use your own brain?
_________________________________________________________________
J.K. Rowling
“ I mean, you could claim that anything's real if the only basis for
believing in it is that nobody's proved it doesn't exist! ”
― J.K. Rowling
On 11/30/2018 1:43 AM, Mostafa Almahdy wrote:
Hello everyone. I hope you are keeping really well. Subsequent to my
last e-mail that included an answer to mr Roger's question, I'd like
today to discuss some key factors as to why Atheism relentlessly grows
in the western world. Some may prejudiciously presume that science is
the primal motive for emerging faith incredulity. At its inception, we
must plainly fathom that science is indeed the furthest from this
controversial phenomenon. The first reason in my opinion is the
unexplainable theory of theodicy. Theologists often are influenced
with rough sledding situation as they attempt to explain this
immensely contentious concept to people. So, what is theodicy? It is
the branch of theology that defends God's goodness and justice in the
face of the existence of evil. So, the argument goes as namely. If God
exists and He is distinctly omnipotent, why has evil been so dominant
and broadly influential? This is truly the toughest question Atheists
ask. In order to answer this properly, we must recognise something. In
Islam, good and evil are equally God's creation. So in Islam, evil is
part of our life experience. This life is not meant for bliss. It
contains moments of joy and others of sorrow. It has days of ease and
others of asperity. So, all types of miseries and catastrophes occur
with God's full knowledge and discretion. Christians say God is good.
So why did he allow for these grave calamities to happen? This is what
Atheists often respond with to the statement of God is good. Both have
missed the reality in my opinion. As Atheists inveterately impeach
faith of being the major source of evil on earth, I'd like to pose
this to them, what for the two great wars of our modern era have been
fought? Has religion been involved in the two greatest wars of our
modern days? Moreover, is Marxism so innocent? Some may ask, do
Atheists have morals? Yes, of course they do. However, their
perception and apprehension of moral standards is quite different from
ours. So for instance, I as Muslim refrain from illicit wedlock for
essentially religious reasons. While for Atheists, this motive doesn't
exist. They generally view moral tenets in a relative manner. They
generically embrace the philosophical concept of relativism. It is the
conviction that all criteria of judgment are relative to the
individuals and situations involved. This concept has been
substantially inferred in many fields of western lifestyle nowadays.
So for instance, the relationships between men and women is not
restricted in western culture. Even if the person attends Church
regularly, he still could have intimate relationships with adult
members of the opposite gender without a genuine marriage contract.
That doesn't easily occur in Muslim countries. Faith devotion is the
reason. But for many westerns, there is no problem if they never get
married. Even farther, devoted Church attendants could be either
homophiles or perhaps bisexuals. That doesn't earn criticism from the
society nor even clergy. They purposely modify their stance on these
critical subjects, hoping to possibly increase the already denigrated
amount of committed attendants. One of the prodigious reasons of
aiding Atheism to grow in the west is the deliberate desecration of
scripturally reputed religious figures. In March 2014, A film called
Noah has been released in the United States. It stars Russell Crowe
acting Noah. It has been banned in movie theaters of major Muslim
countries. Why? Because personating prophets of God in any manner is
considerably viewed as an act of blasphemy in the Muslim faith. This
perspective may seem awkward or ungrasped by others. Atheists consider
religion a primary cause of a vast majority of the most heinous,
racist, atrocious, mean-spirited, hateful aspects of
human beings. Well, a question then, and I hope if someone dares to
answer, he'll be fair. What has World War II been fought for? World
War II was the deadliest military conflict in history in absolute
terms of total casualties. Over 60 million people were killed, which
was about 3% of the 1940 world population. That's tremendously
horrific at the slightest. Has religion been involved in these
ruthlessly mass carnages? Not at all. This war had been motivated by
ultranationalistic agendas. So, why pro patriotism principles haven't
been criticised then? Israel bases its primal tenets on solidly
nationalistic grounds. They savagely murder innocent civilians and
coldbloodedly confiscate Palestinian territory. As they do so, they
explicitly fend for their unprecedentedly nationalistic agenda. The
western world looks at the awful situation there in absolutely
heartless manner and careless disposal. Perhaps that's why many
westerns today seek refuge with Atheism to relatively eliminate their
sociological insight from constantly scolding them. Incidentally, the
vast majority of Israeli citizens are stringently irreligious. Be that
as it may, conservative Protestants endorse Israel with full backing.
So as Muslims we must fathom, what does religion signify for most
westerns? It basically signifies a merely symbolic gesture. They do
not venerate religious tenets. They do not adhere ethical principles.
They go wherever their temporal interest leads them to. So for
instance, as the Saudi royal family is formally indicted of brutally
murdering the journalist, Trump concorded to remain silent if he is
paid well by the Saudi's. As soon as they pay him, the matter will
simply be covered up. The congress won't do something if they were
either bribed or even threatened. Similarly, the NRA knew well how to
keep congressional members utterly silenced through either bribery or
imposing minatory development. This is how these matters work therein
folks. Religion is not really considered in their accounts. So, as
Atheism grows rapidly in the west, people seek refuge with its
absolute darkness because they destine to flee ethical responsibility.
What's the meaning of life if it's purposeless? If life in the west is
unambiguously prosperous, why are there plenty of suicidal attempters
there? At least the quarter of youngsters successfully commits
felo-de-se in Sverige. In San Francisco California, passably 60
individuals attempt to throw themselves off the Golden Gate Bridge
annually, stats state. Why is this, if people are indeed happier than
us here in the Middle East? The answer is clear. The claim of
incomparable felicity of westerns versus us here is emphatically
fraudulent. Otherwise, we would have seen genuine signs of this. It is
an intemperate superstition which unprovably proposes that religion is
the chief source of grief. Religion is the key element by which we are
competent to cope with rough adversities. In my previous post, I
refuted the deliberate disarray of rational and empirical evidence.
Atheists rely on chiefly physically perceived notions. Concisely, they
just couldn't exert rational substantiations. If someone is interested
to discuss the subject with me a bit further, you could commence doing
so by responding to this thread. Alternatively, you could find me on
Skype if you search for ebob824@xxxxxxxxx Lastly, you could text me on
Whatsapp at 00201001479199. Opt the best way of contacting me for you
and start interacting. This is someone who devotes himself to actual
tenets of moderate Sunni Islam and who is willing to unfeignedly
oppugn western ascendancy and its alleged eligibility in all fields of
life. Thank you for patiently reading and hopefully, discerning. This
is Mr Mustafa greeting you from Cairo Egypt on this blessed Friday
morning my time.
