CJ, I sympathize with your feeling that, "in general we don't know, in science, or social science, or philosophy for that matter how to properly talk about "time."" I have done something to help solve that problem. I hold that the static systems of logic?descended from Aristotle through Boole [1], Frege, Pnueli, Prior, and all modern logicists and natural philosophers?are lacking in several respects. These many models of logical specification [2] are unable to describe or to create any more than was given (sum of the parts); or directly express causation (which instead must be divined from the static representations); and they can't be used to express or treat dynamic or changing scenarios, thus they can't deal directly with ongoing time or processes which evolve with time. Now these observable attributes, including synergy or emergent behavior, cause and effect, dynamic activities and ongoing time, are very evident in the real world. The simple process of combustion, which takes place many times per second in billions of engines worldwide, could not be directly and completely specified in any of those existing systems of logic without describing a succession of frozen states, frame-by-frame. This failing, of course, justifies the existence of the hard sciences in order to "take up the slack." Chemistry, for instance, has means with which to describe and explain combustion. 1. George Boole's An Investigation of the Laws of Thought. 2. About thirty "non-standard" logics (aside from predicate calculus and propositional logic) are listed in http://www.earlham.edu/~peters/courses/logsys/nonstbib.htm <http://www.earlham.edu/~peters/courses/logsys/nonstbib.htm> In my perception, one of the troubles with philosophy, logic, computational "intelligence," etc. is that the formal logic used to specify, explicate, deduce, and substantiate or support concepts and systems, is confined to frames in the space-domain. All temporal references, therefore, must be referred to tokens and labels situated in space. The ancients played with concepts by writing them down and by thinking of them in fixed format. We can now do the same using computers, but the operators have not expanded with the passing of millennia. We are thus limited to combinations and sequences of AND (conjunction), NOT (negation), and STORE (memorize). The whole of computer science is founded on not much more than those operators. First-order and modal logics are fundamentally static means through which actions are reckoned from fixed statements or frames, evaluated after-the-fact. Such static treatment, even aided by super-fast computers, often fails to produce results appropriate for dynamic processes. Using static and fixed labels, formal logic discourse admits only of existence, non-existence, and conjunction in both space and time. This package of restrictions in thought exempts dynamics from that frozen arena. But life exhibits self-motivated activities. How can such functions be specified or even explored by using formal logic that admits only static states or static labels about dynamic states? Aside from how an item, or a condition, is and how it relates to other things in tableaux, I want to know or be able to precisely and concisely specify how it came to be, what caused it, and how it acts. There doesn't seem to be any such treatment in formal logic, although in ordinary language we routinely express dynamics in a way that most understand our meaning. My question was, and is, "How do you properly treat dynamical situations with only static tools such as Turing machines and Boolean logic?" The accepted answer is, "frame by frame." That acceptance, in my estimation, is insufficient. As Bergson put it, in Time and Free Will, "Where is the becoming?" As Dr. Lee Smolin (in The Trouble With Physics) asked, "How can we represent time without turning it into space?" I have answered all of those questions with a new system of logic that includes verbs as dynamic operators and which allows causative forces and the changes they make to be recognized, specified, documented, and analyzed; and (in control systems) to have direct and instantaneous effects on physical processes. In my non-computational, non-Turing method of reckoning, Natural Logic (NL), I have greatly expanded the vocabulary of logic. In NL there are many more logic functions (permutations of logic operators) and corresponding logic elements than are available in the combinations of AND, NOT, and STORE of purely conventional means. The new operators and elements operate natively in the time and space-time domains on the natural flow of events and condition changes in dynamic processes. The ancients held that the logical forms, especially premises, were to be held unchanged (otherwise how could conclusions be valid?). It has been held so even in modern times, although now we can see that change is the only constant. There is, however, no "logic of change" currently accepted. I invented one that is useful in the world of automation. It may also be useful to logicists in general and to philosophers. Best regards, Charlie