[SI-LIST] Re: 0306 Capacitors
- From: steve weir <weirsp@xxxxxxxxxx>
- To: leeritchey@xxxxxxxxxxxxx, "David Greig" <DGreig@xxxxxxxxx>,Farah.Haddadin@xxxxxxxxx,"Ken Patterson" <pattken@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>, si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Tue, 09 Mar 2004 10:55:28 -0800
Lee, it is certainly true that the via inductance of a typical 4/6 layer
board swamps out the low inductance of an IDC. They can still reduce
component count though if real-estate is the premium, and lots of
capacitance is needed, and cost is not a major factor. Mounted, I have
IDCs at 460pH, but I think I can do a little better than that and maybe get
them down to 400pH, or about 1/3 an 0603 with two pads. On a pad cost
basis they still don't win as that is eight vias versus six for the 0603s
they replace. At 425pH mounted ( assuming I could get there ), they would
just be equivalent in holes to 0603s with two vias per pad. So they can
reduce components and area, but at the high price premium they carry, they
are not going to reduce cost.
Now what is really interesting is that I can do better, ( under 300pH at
the planes ) with a single X2Y which is certainly under $0.05. If minimum
real-estate is needed and cost matters, then either X2Y's alone, or in
combination with some ordinary 0603s preferably in X5R chemistry seems to
be the cheapest solution I can find for any PDS from 100 milliohms down to
1 milliohm.
Steve.
At 10:32 AM 3/9/2004 -0800, Lee Ritchey wrote:
>IDS capacitors work well on IC packages because it is possible to achieve
>very low mounting inductance. No to so for PCBs.
>
>
> > [Original Message]
> > From: David Greig <DGreig@xxxxxxxxx>
> > To: weirsp@xxxxxxxxxx <weirsp@xxxxxxxxxx>; <Farah.Haddadin@xxxxxxxxx>;
>Ken Patterson <pattken@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>; <si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> > Date: 3/9/2004 7:28:13 AM
> > Subject: [SI-LIST] Re: 0306 Capacitors
> >
> > Steve
> >
> > Check out the IDS's on the 34th page of
> > http://www.avxcorp.com/docs/masterpubs/smccp.pdf
> > Intel seem to be using them on P4 packages.
> >
> > Regarding 0306's, they are available and are really useful in high
>frequency
> > analog decoupling apps.
> >
> >
> > Best Regards,
> >
> > David Greig
> > ________________________
> > David Greig
> > Design Consultant
> > Direct Line 01383 843331
> > ________________________
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: steve weir [mailto:weirsp@xxxxxxxxxx]
> > Sent: 09 March 2004 14:31
> > To: Farah.Haddadin@xxxxxxxxx; Ken Patterson; si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > Subject: [SI-LIST] Re: 0306 Capacitors
> >
> >
> > Farah,
> >
> > I believe Murata does make 0306's, but you will get lower inductance at a
> > much lower price from an 0603 X2Y. The only caveat is that you are
> > presently limited to 200nF in the X2Y, whereas an 0306 in X5R can support
> > larger values. Unmounted an 0306 is about 190-200pH, whereas an 0603 X2Y
> > is about 120pH.
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> >
> > Steve.
> > At 08:16 AM 3/9/2004 -0600, Haddadin, Farah wrote:
> >
> > >I tried AVX... They don't make 0306 caps, although their data sheets
> > >indicate that they do.
> > >
> > >Thanks,
> > >Farah
> > >
> > >-----Original Message-----
> > >From: Ken Patterson [mailto:pattken@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx]=20
> > >Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2004 8:16 AM
> > >To: Haddadin, Farah; si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > >Subject: RE: [SI-LIST] 0306 Capacitors
> > >
> > >
> > >Try AVX. They make a line of reverse aspect caps.
> > >
> > >Regards,
> > >
> > >Ken
> > >
> > >-----Original Message-----
> > >From: Haddadin, Farah [mailto:Farah.Haddadin@xxxxxxxxx]
> > >Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2004 9:11 AM
> > >To: si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> > >Subject: [SI-LIST] 0306 Capacitors
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >Experts,
> > >
> > >Does anybody know vendors that can produce 0306 ceramic capacitors?
> > >
> > >Thanks,
> > >Farah
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