-=PCTechTalk=- Re: XP Musical boot failure
- From: "recklessmaverick@xxxxxxxxxx" <recklessmaverick@xxxxxxxxxx>
- To: pctechtalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Wed, 29 Jul 2009 08:31:55 -0400
- - - See below:
Gman wrote:
> See below:
>
>
>>
>>
>> The XP install was first. Then Vista. Then XP was imaged followed by
>> Vista and the Data Drive.
>>
>
>
> This changes my initial guess, although I'm not yet sure where it sends it.
>
> - - - I don't know either as I thought that was the sequence I included in my
> original message.
>
>> Data drive was moved and moved back by Vista. XP became screwed up.
>>
>
>
> Was XP fired up at any time while the data drive was not where XP expected
>
> it to be?
- - - No, not that I can remember.
> Restored Data drive. Restored XP. Rewrote the Vista MBR using EasyBCD.
>
> XP was already messed up by this point, so the proverbial "if" is likely to
> be found within an action (or inaction) prior to this exercise.
>
> - - - I agree, restoring happened after the problem. Question is why didn't
> it fix the problem. To answer that we need to know what caused the problem.
>
>> ***** If Vista hijacked permissions, I suspect I would need to restore
>> Vista to release the hostages. But, since the restored XP had those
>> permissions, why didn't restoring it fix it? Could something have made
>> changes to ntldr that would cause the problem?
>>
>
>
> The rest of these questions appear to focus specifically on my suggestion of
> 'Permissions'. Never lose track of the fact that this entire suggestion is
> only a guess. "IF" a serious inquiry were to be brought into this mystery,
> it could very well turn out to be something else entirely.
>
> - - - What else might be the culprit?
>
> Under NTFS, permissions are written directly to the drive holding the
> 'permissioned' items. A restore of the Vista &/or XP volumes would do
> nothing to modify the permissions physically stored on the NTFS formatted
> Data drive. Only a restore of the Data drive could do that.
>
> - - - This suggests that the data drive restore "should" have fixed the
> problem UNLESS the "permissions" are contained in an area that was not
> included in the image. Perhaps the FAT?
>
>> What might have had permissions hijacked that would cause the hang at
>> the point where it hangs?
>>
>
>
> An important XP system file needed at XP's boot that did not give XP
> permission to engage it when it was called from the XP registry during
> bootup.
>
> - - - Is there a way to determine what might be the culprit?
>
>> If XP doesn't see the my documents folder, it simply creates a new one
>> where it expects to find it.
>>
>
>
> True.
>
>
>
>> AVG Suite, MS Office 2007, MS Plus Digital Media Edition and Vispics
>> were the only programs installed in XP and they were installed with the
>> Program Files folder on the data drive.
>>
>
>
> Noted.
>
>
>
>> ***** It would seem to me the "missing" program files folder would
>> simply create error messages during boot and start up rather than hang
>> the boot itself since (I assume) startup programs don't start until
>> Windows is loaded.
>>
>
>
> If the registry had been told to use a separate volume for its Program Files
> folder, all already existing Program Files files & folders need to be Copied
> over to that volume. If this is not done, Windows is likely to go looking
> in the wrong location for the files added to this system folder during the
> install. In other words, it will look for most (but not all) of them in the
> new location. If they are not where they are expected to be, unexpected
> results can be expected instead. As a precaution against this, I Copy the
> original to the new location, make the necessary changes to the registry to
> tell Windows to use the new location for both 'Program Files' & 'Common
> Files' and then leave the old ones right where they are.
>
>
>
>
>
> - - - During installation some programs do
> not give option to select where to install. I assume at least some of those
> would look to the registry to find the default program files folder. I would
> not be surprised to learn that some do not and instead automatically install
> to C:\Program Files. If something like that was installed could/would it be
> a contibuting factor? If a program that does not use the registry default
> but did give the option where to install and I oooopsed and failed to select
> the data drive, would/could that be a factor?
>
>> ***** At any rate I will simply reinstall both systems and start over.
>> And everything is going to go where the OS wants it to be. And then I
>> may try relocating the "My Documents" and "Documents folders to the Data
>> Drive (or maybe an external) and point XP and Vista (respectively) to
>> them. I'm thinking that using the internal data drive will be best and
>> just "sync" it to an external when I need to go portable.
>>
>
>
> Fair enough. Although you are choosing to use much less than you have
> learned here, the fact remains that you now know a heck of a lot more than
> you did before you started these experiments. Perhaps it's time to drop the
> 'reckless' part from your name. ;)
> - - - I have not yet done the reinstall of anything. Since I have access to
> everything I need to do in Vista (Thank goodness for portable applications on
> an external drive) I am in no hurry to do so as long as it might be useful to
> keep the problem around in order to do troubleshooting or just poking around
> looking at things. I have a feeling that some of the "reckless" remains so
> I won't be in a hurry to change that either. :-))
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