Hi
When in doubt (which is always when it concerns oracle licensing) turn to
the Oracle Sales people and ask them.
Their answer may not be satisfactory but at least it passes an audit.
Jack van Zanen
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On Sat, Jul 23, 2016 at 3:54 AM, Dimensional DBA <
dimensional.dba@xxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
I have never found a lawyer or Chief legal counsel that is completely
happy with any contract they do not get an opportunity to change, however I
have never had a Chief Legal counsel have any problem with the acceptance
of the OTN.
In answer to some of your questions.
"What is the legal definition of software development vs software testing.
Production is legally defined but all the rest is ......"
I think here you are trying to parse the phrase
" purpose of developing, testing, prototyping, and demonstrating Your
application and only as long as Your application has not been used for any
data processing, business, commercial, or production purposes, and not for
any other purpose."
The phrase is tied together and because of all the legal/tax documentation
surrounding development, some explanation can found here
(https://tax.network/cjohnson/capitalize-costs-of-software-development/)
and yes tax law may seem more daunting than a regular legal contract.
I believe you are trying to split hairs from an argument standpoint of
testing for net new development which the first covers versus testing for
an application that is already in production. This agreement just like the
tax laws make it clear that anything related to the production application
is separate, which is covered by the second part of the phrase.
As to:
"Many have issues with the whole dependent on another product stuff. What
happens if 10 years down the road they drop the licensed product but
continue to use the the dependent product unknowingly."
Chief legal counsel would quote the common phrase (and yes I have had one
say it to me)
"Ignorance of the law is no excuse" or in this case ignorance of what you
are doing/have done is no excuse if it violates a contract or the law.
An example that I ran into once was the Audix Voicemail server that had an
Oracle 7.3 database under the covers. I only found out about it because the
NT Admin responsible was having some problems and came to me because the
error he received when he looked it up on google pointed to an Oracle
database. I helped him with his problem of course and in later license
review when I was trying to account for all database licenses , I asked
about this one and when we pulled the product legal contract there is
wording in the original contract that the Oracle database could only be
used for the AUDIX product. So if you were to remove AUDIX and just use the
Oracle database you would be in violation of the license, period no excuses.
Both of these
Is a bug fix development of a new program? or Production maintenance?
Is testing of a program that has not reached production, development
testing or production testing?
goes back to the write off software development article, your Chief Legal
counsel or even your finance people will tell you
Bug fix of a new development that cannot under the law be associated as
maintenance of a current program, is net new development not production
maintenance.
If you are testing a program that has not been in production then it is
development testing not maintenance.
You also have to remember the OTN agreement is not necessarily the only
agreement you are working under.
If you have no Oracle licenses at all then this is the only agreement that
applies relative to Oracle SW (along with the agreement you signed for
signing up to OTN) and it is very simple if you are in development life is
great, but the moment you start using the application/Oracle SW for any
production use you need to follow the OTN license and pay for real licenses
for development and production.
If you have even one Oracle license then you are operating in a different
world which I have spoken about in the past that there are many rules in
the contracts that have been signed which expand the definitions and scope
of what you are required to do.
Buried in your Oracle contracts are a variety of legal statements,
depending on the contract which may include
"you must maintain support licensing on all Oracle licensed products you
own", so you are not allowed to remove support on some database licenses
that you will just let that system die off after a time. I had a one client
some RAC licenses that we were not using, but had a future plans to build
RAC down the road in a year or so when we would need to scale out, so the
idea was to not pay support until we actually needed them again. Not
allowed.
Special note to everyone, based on the OTN license and what is in most
Oracle contracts, if you decided to test a product like say Golden Gate
against an application that was in production in your company, you
technically have to purchase a license to perform that testing. In order to
be on solid ground for this requirement you should always speak to your
Oracle sales rep and your chief legal counsel. You will get in writing from
your Sales Rep that you can download and use the software for x amount time
to perform your tests at no charge and your Chief legal counsel will
normally touch base with you that you have completed your testing and
removed the software. You should never just take some sales person word for
it that everything is fine, download the software. Always get it in
writing. Luckily Oracle had been reasonable in this area of not going after
people who really just tested the software then removed it or decided to
purchase it, however when it comes to a license audit, the contracts will
apply and under contract/OTN agreement you technically owe Oracle money if
the application is in production.
Again any Chief Legal counsel will tell you it is all their in black and
white, if you take the opportunity to read it. I have never found a Chief
legal counsel not willing to talk to you or direct you to one of the
lawyers below them to talk to or to get you a copy of the contract to
peruse. They are normally very happy that you are taking an interest in
their work and trying to protect the company. Gentle reminder as chief
legal counsel is normally a C-Level equivalent, don't abuse that privilege
of their time.
Matthew Parker
Chief Technologist
Dimensional DBA
425-891-7934 (cell)
D&B 047931344
CAGE 7J5S7
Dimensional.dba@xxxxxxxxxxx
View Matthew Parker's profile on LinkedIn
www.dimensionaldba.com
-----Original Message-----
From: oracle-l-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:oracle-l-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]
On Behalf Of Dave Morgan
Sent: Friday, July 22, 2016 7:55 AM
To: Oracle-L
Subject: Re: Oracle License
Even lawyers don't understand Oracle licensing.
What is the legal definition of software development vs software testing.
Production is legally defined but all the rest is ......
The whole OTN agreement contradicts itself. I have yet to find a lawyer
that finds the OTN license acceptable.
Many have issues with the whole dependent on another product stuff. What
happens if 10 years down the road they drop the licensed product but
continue to use the the dependent product unknowingly.
Is a bug fix development of a new program? or Production maintenance?
Is testing of a program that has not reached production, development
testing or production testing?
I tell the clients how many sockets I believe they need to be licensed
for, and then I document which license I believe every database and Oracle
application I know about is under.
After that I do lots of arcane and superstitious things, like drinking,
that are absolutely required to regain sanity after attempting to deal with
Oracle licensing complexities
YMMV
Dave
--
Dave Morgan
Senior Consultant, 1001111 Alberta Limited dave.morgan@xxxxxxxxxxx
403 399 2442
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