[obol] Re: "which finch" is getting mixed votes
- From: David Irons <llsdirons@xxxxxxx>
- To: "dpvroman@xxxxxxxxxx" <dpvroman@xxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Wed, 18 Feb 2015 09:18:19 -0800
Thanks Mike and Dennis for the clarification on plumage sequences in Purple
Finch. I knew that young males could retain a female-like appearance well into
second year (hence singing "females"), but I did not realize that they don't
acquire red feathering until their first prebasic molt (fall of their second
year). Is the streaking on the breast then not lost until early in their third
year when they go through their second prealternate molt? It seems that there
might be a recognizable first basic (second winter) plumage.
Dave Irons
Sent from my iPhone
> On Feb 18, 2015, at 8:44 AM, "Dennis Vroman" <dpvroman@xxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
> Mick's age is correct for submission of data to the banding lab, if Linda's
> bird was banded. It's an After Second Year (ASY) bird. At this time of the
> year, a Second Year (SY - fledged last year, or 2014) males would still be
> all brown (unless something pretty unusual happened to the bird causing
> feather loss). SY males would normally not turn red until the fall molt.
> Then you would see birds with both old brown feathers and new red ones until
> molt was completed.
>
> Anyway, Linda's bird is a Purple Finch
>
> Dennis
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Patterson" <celata@xxxxxxxxxxxx>
> To: "OBOL" <obol@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> Sent: Wednesday, February 18, 2015 7:31 AM
> Subject: [obol] Re: "which finch" is getting mixed votes
>
>
>> There are some terminology issues that may be muddying the discussion.
>> These terms are only important because they are the terms one is going
>> to have to know to sort through the literature on aging birds and
>> understanding things like molt progression and timing.
>>
>> First, Linda's finch cannot be a "1st year" bird because the photo was
>> taken after January 1st. 1st year (more appropriately hatch-year)
>> denotes a bird in it natal year. All birds magically turn into second
>> year birds on January first.
>>
>> The expectation is that a male second year Purple Finch will look very
>> much like a female through October of its second year. Linda's bird
>> shows quite a bit of red in the head, but is still (probably) too brown.
>> This suggests that it is a transitional bird molting from the plumage
>> associated with the second-year to adult male plumage. We can therefore
>> argue, because it's after January first, that this is a bird in its
>> third year. On the data form we would call this after-second-year.
>>
>> The terminology is arcane and different authorities sometimes use
>> different words. The language presented above is what the Bird Banding
>> Laboratory requires.
>>
>> So, to re-cap:
>>
>> Hatch-year=first-year...(juvenile/1st-basic/1st-winter may also be
>> bandied about, but are plumage/molt based markers, not calendar markers)
>>
>> Second-year... any bird that was HY on Dec 31 becomes SY (or
>> after-hatch-year in birds that do not show unique SY traits)
>>
>> Adult... any bird that has adult plumage. In the case of Purple
>> Finches, we can call males in adult plumage after-second-year, because
>> they have distinctive second-year plumage characters.
>>
>> So, Linda's bird, because of the amount of red in the head, kind of has
>> to be a bird in its third year or older (after-second-year). It is
>> most probably a third-year bird and mathematically about two and a half
>> years old.
>>
>> Confused? Don't be. It's still a Purple Finch. The other stuff will
>> not be on the test.
>>
>> --
>> Mike Patterson
>> Astoria, OR
>> Problem? what problem?
>> http://www.surfbirds.com/community-blogs/northcoastdiaries/?p=2667
>
>
>
>
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