Thanks Alex. I just remember going through something like you have with my old SE years ago and taking it in for repairs. Clock out? the techie asked. Probably just the battery. Unplugged small battery, put a new one in, charged me about $30 to do it and the system ran fine. I don't even know if G4s have such a thing. Users can subscribe to the List by sending an email to <muglo-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> with 'subscribe' in the Subject field Users can unsubscribe from the List by sending an email to <muglo-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> with 'unsubscribe' in the Subject field Users must send messages or replies to <muglo@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> All messages are archived so that you can view them at any time by going to <//www.freelists.org/archives/muglo> Problems concerning use of the FreeList should be sent to <paulthomas@xxxxxxx> Don't forget to periodically check our web site at: http://muglo.on.ca/