Michael Chase wrote: "Phil Enns refers to the "non-violence" of early Christians, and cites Tertullian in his favor. But was it really violence *as such* that early Christians objected to, or rather enlistment in the *pagan* army, and fighting for the *pagan* state?" Michael is correct that early Christians objected to the paganism that was actively promoted within the Roman army. So this objection was one reason why they rejected military service. Furthermore, Michael is correct that most early Christians did not object to violence as such. I have tried to be careful in my comments to claim only that they held non-violent beliefs and not that they were pacifists as we think of that term. They were not pacifists. One could divide up the early Christians into three rough groups with regards to non-violent beliefs. The first group would include people like Tertullian who held that the sword was taken from Peter to show that it would be Jesus/God who would be doing the fighting. These people believed that a spiritual battle was raging between the divine and the demonic, and that in Jesus the battle had been decisively won and would soon come to an end. The second group would include people like Augustine who held that Christians were not to engage in violence but that it was permissible for rulers to use violence to bring about peace. That is, violence was to be avoided by Christians but it wasn't to be absolutely rejected. The third group would include people like Origen who reject the sword completely because God is love as shown in Jesus. God is acting to save all of humanity and therefore the Christian attitude towards all humanity ought to be that of love. This last group is perhaps closest to what we would now think of as pacifist. Therefore, while one of the reasons for holding a belief in non-violence was because violence was often associated with the pagan army and state, this reason was not primary. Tertullian is hardly an example of orthodox early Christianity and, as Michael noted, some of his writings ought to make us wince, but he does provide some insight into the beliefs held at that time. Sincerely, Phil Enns Toronto, ON ------------------------------------------------------------------ To change your Lit-Ideas settings (subscribe/unsub, vacation on/off, digest on/off), visit www.andreas.com/faq-lit-ideas.html