[lit-ideas] "Il pleut! Il pleut!" (Locke's Parrot (Was: Grice's Pirot
- From: Jlsperanza@xxxxxxx
- To: lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Sun, 14 Oct 2007 14:20:12 EDT
Andreas Ramons writes:
>It's one of the odd features about language that you don't need to >form
the idea first and then say it.
I disagree, and Locke (who wrote "An essay concerning Humane Understanding"
in 1690, Book III being relevant here: The Way of Words) would, too.
His example is that of the Parrot (Grice later adapts this as a Pirot for
some obscure reason).
The difference between the Parrot and the Person, Locke claims is that the
Parrot does as exactly what Ramos thinks is the normal procedure with Danish
or English:
>you don't think before you say it
Odd that Ramos would use 'idea', which is _the_ Lockean term _par
excellence_. Parrots cannot _say_ it (in the oratio obliqua sense of 'say),
because
they have _no_ idea of what they are _saying_.
You can _train_ a parrot to say, "Il pleut! Il pleut!" (It rains! It rains,
-- the old man is snoring, etc.)
but you hardly would like to say that the parrot _said_ that it was raining.
Cheers,
JL
J. L. Speranza, Esq.
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