[ibis-macro] Re: AMI Info Model_Specific parameters: Market Speed vs Standards Speed
- From: "Walter Katz" <wkatz@xxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <kwillis@xxxxxxxxxxx>, <Arpad_Muranyi@xxxxxxxxxx>, "'IBIS-ATM'" <ibis-macro@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Fri, 25 Mar 2011 09:40:27 -0400 (EDT)
Ken,
We have done the exactly the same thing, for the same reasons.
Walter
From: ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Ken Willis
Sent: Friday, March 25, 2011 9:30 AM
To: wkatz@xxxxxxxxxx; Arpad_Muranyi@xxxxxxxxxx; 'IBIS-ATM'
Subject: [ibis-macro] Re: AMI Info Model_Specific parameters: Market Speed
vs Standards Speed
Walter,
I think there are some differences here with regards to Sigrity, Gennum,
and back-channel.
For a new capability like back-channel, you need to do proof-of-concept
first. One good way to do this is with an external customer, who also has
vested interest in the capability. This is what we have done. Then we went
and brought it to IBIS in efforts to work towards standardization.
But note that the effort is to standardize it in IBIS. We are not simply
pushing through what we have already implemented. The first discussion of
back-channel the IBIS-ATM committee had on this brought some significant
changes to what we had done initially. This is all part of the process,
and is expected.
Note also that the Gennum models have been implemented so that you can
turn back-channel "off" and use them as standard IBIS-compliant AMI
models. There is nothing blocking anyone from using any IBIS-compliant
tool with these models.
Thanks,
Ken Willis
Sigrity, Inc.
860-871-7070
kwillis@xxxxxxxxxxx
_____
From: ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Walter Katz
Sent: Thursday, March 24, 2011 4:30 PM
To: Arpad_Muranyi@xxxxxxxxxx; 'IBIS-ATM'
Subject: [ibis-macro] AMI Info Model_Specific parameters: Market Speed vs
Standards Speed
Arpad,
The fundamental problem that we face is the need for IC Vendors to supply
System Companies with models that they can use today to design next
generation high speed products. Info parameters in BIRDS 121-124 are
required to do this today. The market cannot wait for IBIS to approve
this, and then wait for EDA vendors to support it. It is critical that
when it is required to add information to a .ami file that a simulator
must use (e.g. a Model_Specific Info parameter), that the parameter be
published by submitting a BIRD to make it a Reserved_Parameters. The need
for this was described in the OpalT document, and in numerous IBIS-ATM
discussions. In the meantime EDA Vendors have the information they need to
support these advanced capabilities as their markets require them. This is
exactly what Sigrity and Gennum have done with their backchannel proposed
BIRD, and SiSoft will determine when the specification of backchannel is
firm enough, and then support it in our tool when our customers require
it.
Walter
From: ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
[mailto:ibis-macro-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Muranyi, Arpad
Sent: Thursday, March 24, 2011 2:54 PM
To: IBIS-ATM
Subject: [ibis-macro] Re: Table Clarification BIRD
If I remember correctly, we spent a considerable time
on this topic in the last ATM teleconference. In that
discussion I think I heard Walter state something
along the lines of who cares, the EDA tool just copies
everything to the parameter string for DLL and doesn't
need to know whether the first column is a row number
or useful data.
Then the question was raised, how about (Usage Info)
in which case the table is to be consumed by the tool,
and in that case the tool would have to know what the
first column is.
This brought us to the topic of syntax consistency and
ease of parsing, etc.
But this also raises another issue, namely whether the
Model_Specific parameters should ever be (Usage Info).
Note that this is not a problem with Reserved_Parameters,
which supposed to be well defined in the spec.
Comments?
Arpad
==========================================================
Walter Katz
wkatz@xxxxxxxxxx
Phone 303.449-2308
Mobile 720.333-1107
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