Hi John, Yes, your description below is exactly what I want to achieve. The finished surface hopefully will visually show a grain pattern of millions of black and off-white brownish lines. But it will be visual, not tactile as the finished surface will be quite smooth and flat to the touch. John milburn Australia. ----- Original Message ----- From: John Sherrer To: blindwoodworker@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Sent: Tuesday, December 22, 2009 9:43 AM Subject: [blindwoodworker] Re: Urushi/Japanning: a technique or product, or all of the above. John You have gotten me interested in what I think you are wanting to do. I will rehash what I think you said so that we are on the same page. You want to remove the softer wood between the grain lines, causing the grain lines to be higher. Then you want to fill the low areas with Japan laquer. You will then rub the finish down showing only the higher grain and the dark laquer between the grain lines. John http://WhiteCane.org http://BlindWoodWorker.com http://HolyTeaClub.comcom\whitecane http://anellos.ws ----- Original Message ----- From: JDM To: blindwoodworker@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Sent: Saturday, December 19, 2009 11:46 PM Subject: [blindwoodworker] Urushi/Japanning: a technique or product, or all of the above. G'day Larry, thanks for your very helpful feedback on surface preparation , application and finishing of Urushi/Japan. thanks also for clarifying my misunderstanding between Pumice stone and rotten stone. The difference between the 2 forms of rock, and the differences in their use is intriguing. Intriguing also is the question, whether or not Japanning refers to a product, or to a technique. Further, if it is a product, as well as a technique, then what that product is made from. It presently seems from my information hunting, and Larry's informative history on Japanning, that Japan or urushi is both a product and a complex finishing technique. It additionally seems that urushi is a very specific product made from tree sap, while the term Japan applies to a wide variety of products of varnish, lacquer, Shellac and modern synthetics. I don't know, but the whole area of japanning may also be further confused by the different terminology or words used to describe the same thing between the USA and UK/Australia. In Charles Dickens novel, "Oliver Twist", written in 1837, there's a reference to Japanning. In illustrating the criminal slang of street gangs of his day, Dickens has one of his characters, the "Artful Dodger" tell the captive Oliver Twist, to, "Japan my trotters." In the street criminal slang of the day this means, "blacken and polish my shoes!". A paint manufacturer here in Australia markets a product they call Black Japan Varnish, and since my first Email on this subject, I've been able to buy myself a can of it. All I need now, is to find somebody to read the usage instructions on the label. The manufacturers Website is: http://www.feastwatson.com.au/WoodstainsBlackJapan.asp Hmmm, but from reading what I can on this speech unfriendly Website, it seems the job is even more complex than what I originally anticipated. Hope this has been of interest. John milburn Australia. ----- Original Message ----- From: Larry Martin To: blindwoodworker@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Sent: Saturday, December 19, 2009 10:16 AM Subject: [blindwoodworker] Re: Japan lacquering....anybody? John -- I think your plan should work. I have the following comments. In step 2 I don't think you will be able to remove much of the softer wood between the harder grain lines, but you need to do the step in order to remove the raised grain from Step 1. Pumice is different than Rottenstone. Pumice is crystalline quartz silica and rottenstone is aluminum silicate. For fine finishing to a glossy finish, Pumice is a rougher grit than Rottenstone. Pumice is used first, rubbed out and then rottenstone is used and then rubbed out. If you want to fill the pores, you can use any of the grain fillers and you can tint the grain filler any color you want. For Step 3, I don't know of a product called Japan Lacquer nor do I see anyone offering a product of Japan Lacquer. I know the term primarily as describing a Japanese multi-step method of applying lacquer and rubbing it out to produce an extremely smooth, deep finish. For Step 3 for the purpose of coloring the grain, I think any of the stains should work, particularly the gel stain in the color you want, or the darker wood filler you might use in Step 2. Step 4 will be your next step in leveling the surface. You will probably have to repeat Step 2 or Step 3 in combination with Step 4 any number of times to get as smooth of a surface as you are after. In each repetition of the step, you will be sanding off the high points of the grain lines very gradually bringing that surface down to the level of the lower surface between the grain lines. The more you have filled the grain or the pores the sooner the two surfaces will be in the same plane. Step 5 will give you another opportunity to rub out the high points to get them back to the same plane as the lower surface. It's a lot of work, but certainly sounds as if you'[re up to it. Good luck. On Dec 17, 2009, at 11:03 PM, JDM wrote: G'day all, I've just finished making a small footstool. It's made entirely from some leftover Douglas fir, or as we call it here in Oz, Oregon. The wood is deeply grained, and I'm wanting that grain to show in the finished stool. I remember as a kid seeing a wonderful piece of furniture that had been Japanned. The black Japan lacquer had filled the hollows of the grain, while the high ridges of the growth rings had been lightly sanded to make them stand out and show through the black hollows. It produced a most impressive and beautiful result. But search as I might, I can't find any directions on how to do this technique. My present plan to replicate my childhood memory is: 1: Thoroughly wet the surface of the Douglas fir to make the grain stand up really high, 2: Rub along the grain with powdered Pumice stone (also sometimes called Rotten stone, and try to make the hollows even deeper by permanently removing the paler softer wood that lies between the darker, harder and higher annual growth rings, 3: apply the Japan lacquer sideways across the grain, so as to fill the hollows, and mostly wipe off the Japan lacquer from the top of the high spots, 4: Then begin using a fine sandpaper, say 320-400, and rubbing along the grain, in order to leave the hollows filled with the black, hardened Japan lacquer, while the tops of the high standing grain are rubbed back to bare wood, 5: finally, applying a clear high gloss polyurethane coating over the entire surface to weatherproof and protect both the black lacquer in the now filled hollows, and also the high ridges that were brought back to bare wood in step 4. Hopefully, by the time I've finished, the surface of the stool should finish up, more or less completely flat with no tactile grain detectable to the fingertip. That is,, the high ridge lines and the previously low hollows would be flush with each other. But, the beauty and complexity of the original grain pattern would show in sharp contrast as black and pale whitish-brown lines and thus be startlingly visible. Well, to my friends and family anyway! What do others here think of this approach? Maybe there's something I'm missing, or perhaps a better way? Does anybody here have any experience with japanning? John Milburn Melbourne, Australia. Larry Martin woodworkingfortheblind@xxxxxxxxxxx