[THIN] Re: Virtualizing Citrix
- From: "Steve Greenberg" <steveg@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Sat, 26 Jul 2008 09:33:20 -0700
Evan wrote..> the storage side doesn't have to be as expensive as it once
was.
This is an excellent point, a sea change in storage is underway right now. I
like DataCore SAN Melody software because you can take any Intel based
Windows server and any type of storage and create an iSCSI and/or Fiber
Channel SAN. It doesn't have to be expensive anymore, that is definitely
true. However, it is still going to have a cost and involve some complexity
Joe wrote...> I don't understand why shared storage is a necessity for
virtualizing Citrix. HA, vMotion and DRS are way oversold features that are
nice to have but not necessary for virtualizing PS/XenApp
I wonder this all the time, many people have a large investment in SAN to
allow VMotion type capabilities, but when is it really necessary? Don't
people reboot servers as needed now? Isn't that what maintenance windows are
for? I am not saying I don't see the value, I am just questioning how many
environments really need it where it is worth the cost and complexity of the
storage infrastructure behind it.
Steve Greenberg
Thin Client Computing
34522 N. Scottsdale Rd D8453
Scottsdale, AZ 85266
(602) 432-8649
www.thinclient.net
steveg@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
_____
From: thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf
Of Evan Mann
Sent: Saturday, July 26, 2008 5:32 AM
To: thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [THIN] Re: Virtualizing Citrix
While there is no way to avoid the ESX costs themselves, the storage side
doesn't have to be as expensive as it once was. Back in the day, you had to
use a true SAN, but with full support for iSCSI in ESX, you do storage on
the cheap. The cost savings on internal server storage from dedicated boxes
can easily pay off the costs of a low-end iSCSI solution. If you want to
wonder outside of the HCL for storage, you'll find that most any device that
can give you some form of storage with an iSCSI or FC front end will work
just dandy with ESX 3.5. I'm using 1st gen Apple X-Serve RAID's which is
nothing more then a RAID array with a FC front end. Works like a charm, but
not on the HCL. I see VMware has added HP AiO's to the HCL. The AiO is
just Windows Storage Server in an HP box with some HP tools. Given that, I
don't see why a roll -your-own Windows Storage Server wouldn't work like a
champ, giving some really interesting options to build your own storage.
From: thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf
Of Carl Stalhood
Sent: Friday, July 25, 2008 4:49 PM
To: thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [THIN] Re: Virtualizing Citrix
Virtualizing Citrix usually means you have to pay for two new things that
you didn't have to pay before: the virtualization layer (ESX) and shared
storage. Does the server hardware savings make up for the additional cost of
these other items? For non-Citrix servers the answer is normally "yes" since
most are underutilized. Citrix servers are not underutilized so you probably
won't get much savings from hardware consolidation.
Some people say: "we have already invested in VMware and the SAN and have
excess capacity", thus not considering those costs. I think this is a
fallacy since the costs will be paid eventually if you add anything else to
the system and wish you had the extra capacity that is now being used by the
Citrix servers.
On Fri, Jul 25, 2008 at 1:28 PM, Merino, Ormond <Ormond_Merino@xxxxxxx>
wrote:
The balloon driver is actually called the 'Memory Control Driver', and
you can choose to not install it as part of the vmware tools. The
settings at the bottom are ESX host configuration settings, located in
'Advanced Settings' on the 'Configuration' tab of a host in Virtual
Center.
Hope this helps...ormond
-----Original Message-----
From: thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
Behalf Of George Wasgatt
Sent: Friday, July 25, 2008 2:13 PM
To: thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [THIN] Re: Virtualizing Citrix
The tips at virtrix.blogspot.com <http://virtrix.blogspot.com/> refer to a
memory ballooning driver in
VMWare tools that I can't seem to locate. I think that some of those
tips
are just a tad out of date.
And then there's this which is mostly a copy of the virtrix.blogspot
page
but with additional information at the bottom:
http://knmi.wordpress.com/best-practices-for-deploying-citrix-on-esx/
Now if I can just figure out what all that stuff at the bottom is...
-----Original Message-----
From: thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
Behalf
Of msemon@xxxxxxx
Sent: Friday, July 25, 2008 10:01 AM
To: thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [THIN] Re: Virtualizing Citrix
if you are virtualizing Citrix you are going to get less people on per
virtual machine. Count on about 30. Here is a link to some Citrix tips
on
VMware.
http://virtrix.blogspot.com/2007/03/vmware-best-practices-for-deploying.
<http://virtrix.blogspot.com/2007/03/vmware-best-practices-for-deploying.htm
l>
html
Anyone else have some tips?
Mike
Original Message:
-----------------
From: Minero, Hector B CIV NSWCDD, K55 hector.minero@xxxxxxxx
Date: Fri, 25 Jul 2008 09:28:48 -0400
To: thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [THIN] Virtualizing Citrix
Hi all,
I see all these messages going back and forth about virtualization, but
not much information on how Citrix/TS behaves in a virtualized
environment.
A tech./sales person from Dell came yesterday and told me that I could
probably replace 7 of my PowerEdge 2850 with one beefed up PowerEdge
R900 and virtualize the 7 Citrix servers. I find that kind of hard to
believe.
Each of my 2850's can handle about 30 to 40 users concurrently. I just
don't think that an R900 could handle 200 + users with virtual Citrix
servers.
Is anyone out there using VMWare to virtualize Citrix servers in a
production environment?
What kind of hardware?
How many virtual servers per physical server?
How many users?
I would greatly appreciate your advice as I am new to VMWare.
_______________________________
Hector Minero
NSWCDD K55
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