I'd say it's probably a cap or leaky semiconductor on the PIP board. You may need the schematic to troubleshoot this. I remember having a zener diode give some problems once but don't find a note on it. good luck I'm gone for the weekend Robert tvservice@xxxxxxxxxxxxx H & H Electronics Inc ----- Original Message ----- From: "Phil Bader" <tjanphyl@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> To: <techassist@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Friday, April 22, 2005 5:01 PM Subject: [TechAssist] Re: update2: RCA P60752EB, PTK169PEC intermittant video:goes black, has sound > This PIP board looks perfectly clean. I wonder if one of the ICs are > noisey. Caps look clean and ESR good. No ring cracks, tho I resoldered > the cable pins before reassembly. Well it's bad I guess anyway. > Tritronics shows two PIP modules in this set: > "S-PIP PCB" 207824 inactive part, and > "S-PIP MICRO PCB" 207818 not available, can be ordered. > Which one is this one of mine? On the TV's insert paper, it calls it the > "3XXX SPIP". > Phil > > Philip Bader > Jan Phyl TV Inc. (estab. 1976) > 3420 Recker Hwy. Winter Haven, Fl. 33880 > Fax (863) 299-8821 > email: tjanphyl@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > > > > tvservice wrote: > > >If you and the customer are satisfied with picture quality it is OK to leave > >bypassed. > >I have found bypassing this PIP circuit usually gives a poorer picture but > >most people may not see it. > > > > > >----- Original Message ----- > >From: "Phil Bader" <tjanphyl@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> > >To: <techassist@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> > >Sent: Friday, April 22, 2005 4:33 PM > >Subject: [TechAssist] Re: update2: RCA P60752EB, PTK169PEC intermittant > >video:goes black, has sound > > > > > > > > > >>I just don't believe it. I did your bypass. The picture is stable as a > >> > >> > >rock. > > > > > >>I opened that PIP, removed the smaller board inside, looked all over, > >>ESRd the lytics,etc. Found nothing. But I have to agree this seems to > >>have done it. I wish I could just leave this bypass in place. Is it safe? > >>I could give the customer a choice, with/without (if even available) > >>I'll watch this awhile and see. > >>Thanks, all for the help. Will advise. > >>Phil Bader > >> > >>Philip Bader > >>Jan Phyl TV Inc. (estab. 1976) > >>3420 Recker Hwy. Winter Haven, Fl. 33880 > >>Fax (863) 299-8821 > >>email: tjanphyl@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > >> > >> > >> > >>tvservice wrote: > >> > >> > >> > >>>you can bypass PIP module for a test, at p8003 connector cut wire #1 and > >>> > >>> > >#8 > > > > > >>>(chroma in and out) joint them. Do the same thing wire #3 and#6 (luma in > >>> > >>> > >and > > > > > >>>out). > >>>Robert > >>>tvservice@xxxxxxxxxxxxx > >>>H & H Electronics Inc > >>> > >>> > >>>----- Original Message ----- > >>>From: "Phil Bader" <tjanphyl@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> > >>>To: <techassist@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> > >>>Sent: Friday, April 22, 2005 11:30 AM > >>>Subject: [TechAssist] Re: update2: RCA P60752EB, PTK169PEC intermittant > >>>video:goes black, has sound > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>>>Yes, even while video is black(with a bit of distorted parts), I can > >>>>still hit menu and see the OSD, as well as that video output jack I > >>>>mentioned is good. I noticed a lot of PIP mentions, but this is a very > >>>>large PIP module, called "Spip-511". I don't think this is the one with > >>>>the rubber feet that goo up.I opened it and theres a smaller PCB inside > >>>>but no rubber. > >>>>Phil > >>>> > >>>>Philip Bader > >>>>Jan Phyl TV Inc. (estab. 1976) > >>>>3420 Recker Hwy. Winter Haven, Fl. 33880 > >>>>Fax (863) 299-8821 > >>>>email: tjanphyl@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>Larry E wrote: > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>>>Phil, does OSD/Menu work? TV video & Switched video both go through the > >>>>>comb filter & spip module, check C6445 in comb filter, it may be > >>>>> > >>>>> > >cracked > > > > > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>or > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>>>>have poor solder, value is 2700pf, Larry E > >>>>>Larry Eastman > >>>>>American TV & Electronics > >>>>>Crystal River, Fl. 34428 > >>>>>----- Original Message ----- > >>>>>From: "Phil Bader" <tjanphyl@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> > >>>>>To: <techassist@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> > >>>>>Sent: Friday, April 22, 2005 9:51 AM > >>>>>Subject: [TechAssist] update2: RCA P60752EB, PTK169PEC intermittant > >>>>>video:goes black, has sound > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>>I went back and saw the cracked corner of main board and traces > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >around > > > > > >>>>>>location A-26. I repaired two traces but I still have this > >>>>>>vertical-video flashing. > >>>>>>Note: I hooked up my VP301 pattern gen to the set's composite "video > >>>>>>in-1" and my pattern shows the disturbance. S-video input shows it as > >>>>>>well but not quite as bad. Funny, but this set has a video output jack > >>>>>>"video select out". I attached an RCA cable from that to my composite > >>>>>>monitor. Picture is unaffected and good at all times from this output! > >>>>>>So, wherever this jack pulls the video from the TV must be before the > >>>>>>trouble. I am concentrating on vertical at this point. (help!) > >>>>>>Phil Bader > >>>>>> > >>>>>>Phil Bader wrote: > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>>>I pulled the chunk and benched it.Slid the main board out and > >>>>>>>over,studied the bottom under high magnification. I found no cracks > >>>>>>>mentioned or bad traces so far. What I did find was at the junction > >>>>>>>where the yellow yoke wire solders to the board,( location terminal > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >ID > > > > > >>>>>>>"E502" ) and R523, a distinct ring crack all around both wire and > >>>>>>>resistor . Had to use good light and my nerdy magnifier hood with > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >both > > > > > >>>>>>>lenses down! Tho I never actually saw a vertical collapse during the > >>>>>>>effect, I bet what I saw with the video flashing was the TV > >>>>>>>safety-blanking the video as this connection arced. Make sense? Will > >>>>>>>let you know. > >>>>>>>Phil Bader > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>Phil Bader wrote: > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>>>Customer said this intermittant problem happens more now: > >>>>>>>>Sound stays OK. > >>>>>>>>I've seen it: Video intermittantly sort of streaks, then goes, > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >leaving > > > > > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>a > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>>>>>>>black screen. Not the HV,it stays... this is definately just the > >>>>>>>>composite video picture. I'm testing this on the cable tuner input > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>now, > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>>>>>>>not sure if it happens on any other inputs (just got here). > >>>>>>>>I'm a tech from the 1970's and this looks like the symptom where a > >>>>>>>>breakdown switch is dirty and you moved it causing the video to jump > >>>>>>>>out, or a video peaking coil is opening. Kind of a static lines to > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >the > > > > > >>>>>>>>right across the screen then black.Any histories on video loss like > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>this > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>>>>>>>on these? (intermittants like these are difficult to nail down) > >>>>>>>>Phil Bader > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>>>>> > >>>>------------------------------------------------------------------------ - > >>>> > >>>> > >- > > > > > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>- > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>-- > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>>>This Email List is Public. Remove: > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>http://www.tech-assist.org/remove.htm > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>>>>>>Lost Password: http://www.tech-assist.org and select "Login > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>Problems?". > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>>>>>>Appliance Repair List: > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>http://www.tech-assist.org/secure/tip/chatjoin.htm#app > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>>>Email Archives: //www.freelists.org/archives/techassist/ > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>------------------------------------------------------------------------ - > >>>> > >>>> > >- > > > > > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>--- > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>>This Email List is Public. Remove: > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >http://www.tech-assist.org/remove.htm > > > > > >>>>>>Lost Password: http://www.tech-assist.org and select "Login > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >Problems?". > > > > > >>>>>>Appliance Repair List: > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>http://www.tech-assist.org/secure/tip/chatjoin.htm#app > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>>Email Archives: //www.freelists.org/archives/techassist/ > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>------------------------------------------------------------------------- - > >>> > >>> > >- > > > > > >>>> > >>>> > >>>-- > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>>>>This Email List is Public. Remove: > >>>>> > >>>>> > >http://www.tech-assist.org/remove.htm > > > > > >>>>>Lost Password: http://www.tech-assist.org and select "Login > >>>>> > >>>>> > >Problems?". > > > > > >>>>>Appliance Repair List: > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>http://www.tech-assist.org/secure/tip/chatjoin.htm#app > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>>>>Email Archives: //www.freelists.org/archives/techassist/ > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>>> > >>>------------------------------------------------------------------------- - > >>> > >>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>--- > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>>>This Email List is Public. Remove: http://www.tech-assist.org/remove.htm > >>>>Lost Password: http://www.tech-assist.org and select "Login Problems?". > >>>>Appliance Repair List: > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>http://www.tech-assist.org/secure/tip/chatjoin.htm#app > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>>>Email Archives: //www.freelists.org/archives/techassist/ > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>> > >>> > >>-------------------------------------------------------------------------- - > >> > >> > >-- > > > > > >>>This Email List is Public. Remove: http://www.tech-assist.org/remove.htm > >>>Lost Password: http://www.tech-assist.org and select "Login Problems?". > >>>Appliance Repair List: > >>> > >>> > >http://www.tech-assist.org/secure/tip/chatjoin.htm#app > > > > > >>>Email Archives: //www.freelists.org/archives/techassist/ > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>-------------------------------------------------------------------------- > >> > >> > >--- > > > > > >>This Email List is Public. Remove: http://www.tech-assist.org/remove.htm > >>Lost Password: http://www.tech-assist.org and select "Login Problems?". > >>Appliance Repair List: > >> > >> > >http://www.tech-assist.org/secure/tip/chatjoin.htm#app > > > > > >>Email Archives: //www.freelists.org/archives/techassist/ > >> > >> > > > > > >--------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- > >This Email List is Public. Remove: http://www.tech-assist.org/remove.htm > >Lost Password: http://www.tech-assist.org and select "Login Problems?". > >Appliance Repair List: http://www.tech-assist.org/secure/tip/chatjoin.htm#app > >Email Archives: //www.freelists.org/archives/techassist/ > > > > > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- --- > This Email List is Public. Remove: http://www.tech-assist.org/remove.htm > Lost Password: http://www.tech-assist.org and select "Login Problems?". > Appliance Repair List: http://www.tech-assist.org/secure/tip/chatjoin.htm#app > Email Archives: //www.freelists.org/archives/techassist/ ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- This Email List is Public. Remove: http://www.tech-assist.org/remove.htm Lost Password: http://www.tech-assist.org and select "Login Problems?". Appliance Repair List: http://www.tech-assist.org/secure/tip/chatjoin.htm#app Email Archives: //www.freelists.org/archives/techassist/