[ SHOWGSD-L ] Re: training with treats
- From: Kate Syssoloff <rockannand@xxxxxxx>
- To: Kay Springer <showgsd@xxxxxxx>
- Date: Sat, 29 Sep 2012 19:21:22 -0600 (MDT)
Yes, Kay.. It's an individual thing and I respect how you train. However, I'm
not manipulating my dog physically in the conventional way of choke and leash.
I've come from the background of Schutzhund working dog (years ago) where
motivation comes from 'play'. There is no harsh anything, for instance, we use
a wall to heal next to to keep the puppy straight and if forging, we quickly
pat our leg, giving the heal command and change direction in a happy tone, and
patting the pup when it reaches that special spot by the left knee. We
probably do a lot of what you do, except we do not feed. We just play with an
old toy, I use a ball in a sock with lots of knots tied in it.. and, we get the
dog to lock on it and we swing the dog from side to side .... just games.
They go absolutely crazy for that silly thing and learn very quickly.
Kate Syssoloff
Rockannand
----- Original Message -----
From: "Kay Springer" <showgsd@xxxxxxx>
To: rockannand@xxxxxxx
Cc: showgsd-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Sent: Saturday, September 29, 2012 12:11:36 PM
Subject: training with treats
On Sep 29, 2012, at 10:44 AM, Kate Syssoloff wrote:
. And, I don't believe a dog should need to be baited either. Neither in the
conformation ring nor in their obedience training. I'd prefer to appeal to
their minds rather than their stomachs. The smart ones will appreciate a job
well done and a happy tone and pat just as much. When the treats run out, the
dog quits. Dog Trainers have watched trainers feeding feeding feeding zoo
animals for tricks to please the crowds and adopted it as the 'new' way to
train. I think our dogs are smarter than that.
Kate Syssoloff
Rockannand
I have to respond to this. First I think how you train a dog is up to you and
your training philosophy.
However, I don't think saying the use of treats is not needed if the dog has a
good temperament or is naturally smart. I have trained dogs in obedience for
over 30 years both training my own and acting as a trainer in large classes
with multiple breeds. I have earned multiple CDs, CDXs and UDs. And the same
dogs have been trained to show in conformation earning dual titles. I have
always trained using treats when teaching a new command or exercise. I much
prefer it to a collar correction or physically manipulating the dog to do what
you want. Teaching an 8 week old puppy to sit is so much easier using a treat
held above its head than physically pushing the puppy's butt down or using a
collar. It makes it so much more enjoyable for both handler and dog. Same for
teaching a dog to down or heel. I have used treats and targets for go outs in
utility and jumping the broad jump. I have used treats for figure 8s and
finishes. It just makes training so much more fun for both the handler and the
dog.
Eventually, you gradually wean the dogs off the treats once they know the
exercise. I have never had a problem going from treat motivation to no treats
for the final result. My dogs have never quite on me when I don't have treats
for them. Yes, they also get lots of praise and pats along the way. But
teaching a new dog to sit simply by standing next to the dog with praising and
pats just doesn't work as he has no idea what you are praising him for.
I also use treats to teach a puppy to stand - both for the obedience stand and
the conformation stack...use it for up and back so they learn to nail the stack
when they come back to the judge. For pulling out, most puppies will pull on
the leash once they are used to it so they just learn that when I say "lets
go", they pull but when I say heel they don't. If you use a bell or sound for
gaiting around the ring depends I think on the individual dog. Yes, some need
it too look good and others don't. With Strider, I am hiding in the back forty
when he was shown as that works best for him. Again, the way the dog is trained
is an individual decision based on both the dog and the handler.
I know treat training is controversial but it certainly has worked for me over
the years.
Kay Springer
www.showboatgsd.com
Home of Multi BISS & Multi Group Winning
GCh. Rohan's Reward TC,CGC,HT,RE,CDX, CHIC (h,e,t,h) DM Normal
"Strider" 80 BOBs - #5 & #6 GSD
============================================================================
POST is Copyrighted 2011. All material remains the property of the original
author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind
are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the
Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED.
Each Author is responsible for the content of his/her post. This group and its
administrators are not responsible for the comments or opinions expressed in
any post.
ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY
MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS
PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY
FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE
PROSECUTED.
For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxx
VISIT OUR WEBSITE - http://showgsd.org
SUBSCRIPTION:http://showgsd.org/mail.html
NATIONAL BLOG - http://gsdnational.blogspot.com/
============================================================================
Other related posts:
