"I have one with Ch Dean Etta's High Time (Prime Time son)in the 5th generation and Matushka's Orpheus (a Clytemnestra daughter) in the 4th generation. Bitch has a COI of 3.4% Cherri" I pulled out my bitch's COI paperwork. I ran it on 10 generations, at the time I did not have the full 10 generations in all areas of the ped, I think it was complete on 8 generations. In those 8 gens (10 on some) she has Sundance 5 times total, 6:6 in comparison she has Lance 129 times (60/69) with the earliest gen he appears in being 8:8 Just thought it was interesting. I just found another piece of her pedigree too to update with and am now very close to a full 10 gen ped ( a hobby tracing this) I have some reviews going back to the 50s and love to sit and look at them seeing many of the dogs in her ped.Someone mentioned Jeenellyn and she has some of those too that came down from some German lines, she also has a line to Hein. Oh and the Clytemnestra bitch was lance free. I took the above bitch and bred her to a "Lance Free" German Import (he was imported lol) and was very happy with the litter she produced. Now I have to decide what I am going to do with her daughter....lol Have nothing against Lance or any dog...I was looking for vigor and an open pedigree. Cherri ============================================================================ POST is Copyrighted 2005. All material remains the property of the original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE PROSECUTED. For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx VISIT OUR WEBSITE - http://www.showgsd.org ============================================================================