Ok, Carolyn I am confused here. Are you saying that dogs with long necks cannot move correctly from the shoulder rather than as we generally see with short necked dogs that move only from the elbow, with the upper are at about 90 degrees even when "fully" extended. I find this difficult to understand as our dogs have very long , elegant necks , but all move from the shoulder, extending fully from shoulder through elbow to toes. Also one has to take ligamentation and laxity into account, yes? We have observed the "foolers" the ones that extend only from the elbow forward, and usually fall apart at slow speeds, and pastern flippers that we see, generally have short necks to go with other short bones including upper arm, and croup, coupled often with long hocks and too short stifles. Please could you clarify, here? Kathy *http://www.victorygermanshepherds.com*<http://www.victorygermanshepherds.com/> *Home of: CH. Elvaston's Nations Cup TC, 26 BOBs CH. Victory's Leviathan CH. Garter's E-Male of Fran-Jo Anne Isle * * "Victory...*Vires et honestas" ============================================================================ POST is Copyrighted 2010. All material remains the property of the original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. Each Author is responsible for the content of his/her post. This group and its administrators are not responsible for the comments or opinions expressed in any post. ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE PROSECUTED. For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxx VISIT OUR WEBSITE - http://showgsd.org NATIONAL BLOG - http://gsdnational.blogspot.com/ ============================================================================