Erin wrote: >I got these ... striped thigh high stockings >which go with a new plaid mini kilt that I got. This curiously reminded me of Austin (and Grice). In a number of publications they introduced the idea of a 'trouser' word -- which we have discussed elsewhere with D. Ritchie (who also mentioned kilts). The idea -- to use Austin's example -- is that 'real' -- in the expression "real duck" -- is _not_ the word that wears the trousers, since more or less the _same thing_ is conveyed if you say, "duck" ("There's a duck in the pond" vs. "There's a real duck in the pond"). With 'estate', the issue is more complicated. The only quote the OED gives for this under 'estate' is from TOLDERVY: "The good gentleman at the Abbey, who has left you his real estate." from W. TOLDERVY, _Two orphans_, a novel, 1756, p. 265. Since I presume the addressee of the utterance are the orphans (themselves) I thought the utterer would be being just _emphatic_ and pointing that the estate that 'the good gentleman' left was _real_, rather than _imaginary_. The OED collocates this use of 'real estate', under a more general definition of 'state', to mean, in Law, "the interest which any one has in lands, tenements, or any other effects; often with qualifying words or phrases, with "real estate" being "an interest in landed property." There is a plethora of quotations under 'real' which I append below. The idea is to oppose 'real' to 'non-real' or personal, and the criterion is movility (land does not move). As a quote reads: the word "effects," without the word "real," will not ... comprehend "land." So the source must be Aristotelian, who spoke of movement (a lot). One of the quotes mentions that there is more to 'real' than "land": "things real" comprise not only the "land" itself, but also such incorporeal rights as issue out of or are connected with it." but I'm not sure what the author means by 'incorporeal' (does land have a 'body') or the succession of prepositions ("out of or"). -- Cheers, JL Refs. Austin, Sense and Sensibilia Grice, The Conception of Value. ----- 'real estate' in the OED (under 'real'). 'real estate': 1641 Decay Trade 2 The price and measure of all our other means, both personal and real. 1644 G. PLATTES in Hartlib's Legacy (1655) 209 A present estate, either real or personal. 1690 CHILD Disc. Trade (1694) 8 Securities of lands and houses [are] rendered, indeed such as we commonly call them, real securities. 1711 STEELE Spect. No. 97 5 Their real estate shall be immediately vested in the next Heir. 1756 [Two orphans -- above]. 1827 JARMAN Powell's Devises II. 169 The word "effects," without the word "real," will not ... comprehend "land." 1840 Spirit of Times 25 Jan. 562/1 A negro, the holder of a ticket in the grand real estate lottery.., came pushing into a lottery office in great excitement. 1843 Niles' Nat. Reg. 4 Mar. 5 Real estate bank... A committee of the legislature of Arkansas have reported the facts connected with the management of this institution. 1845 STEPHEN Comm. Laws Eng. (1874) II. 9 "Things real" comprise not only the "land" itself, but also such incorporeal rights as issue out of or are connected with it. 1849 Knickerbocker XXXIII. 174 His father had recently made some heavy real-estate purchases. 1854 H. DO THOREAU Walden 88 This experience entitled me to be regarded as a sort of real-estate broker by my friends. 1870 PINKERTON Guide 27 A sale of real estate by order of Orphans' Court..must be public. 1880 Harper's Mag. Sept. 562 This region was..seized upon by real-estate speculators. 1892 KIPLING Lett. of Travel (1920) 85 The packed real-estate offices; the real-estate agents themselves. 1903 Westm. Gaz. 11 Sept. 2/3 The law might almost be forgiven for making no provision for dealing with real-estate-owning paupers. 1965 H. T. ANSOFF Corporate Strategy (1968) vi. 104 A company which primarily buys and sells..may be an investment trust, a pension fund, or a real estate syndicate. 1969 Sydney Morning Herald 24 May 30/1 (Advt.), The Real Estate Institute of New South Wales..will commence the next evening course of lectures in Real Estate and Valuation Practice. 1972 Accountant 17 Aug. 193/2 The cannibalization of assets, particularly of real estate subsidiaries. 1978 S. BRILL Teamsters vi. 208 He sincerely believed that real-estate investments were the gold mines of the future. ------------------------------------------------------------------ To change your Lit-Ideas settings (subscribe/unsub, vacation on/off, digest on/off), visit www.andreas.com/faq-lit-ideas.html