[lit-ideas] Re: Nietzsche's State: Paternalistic or Maternalistic? (Was: Political Philosophy)

  • From: Edward Farrell <ewf@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • To: "" <dmarc-noreply@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> (Redacted sender "Jlsperanza" for DMARC)
  • Date: Wed, 7 Oct 2015 11:00:11 -0700

Thanks to JL for the maternalistic musings.

I was going to say paternalistic state since that seemed to be the
conventional term but at the last minute I changed my mind and used
maternalistic instead, without really having thought through what it
might mean, but feeling somehow that it was more descriptive
of what I had in mind. And so it was interesting read JL's first hit
and see that it is close to what I intended but not quite (I will
now have to read Irving Kristol's article though).

Here's more or less what I had in mind. I see the maternalistic
state as a reflection of the Baby Boomer generation's dream to live
and act freely, unhindered by traditional moral authority and
sanctions, but at the same time be protected from harm. In practice,
"live and act freely" meant dress and behave unconventionally if
desired, have sex with whomever you wanted whenever you wanted
without moral restraint or social disapproval, follow a livelihood
that might carry little expectation of financial reward but get
social approval for it and not the more usual contempt, and not be
required to participate in civic endeavors with which you did not
approve (especially foreign wars). This is the dream of a spoiled
child still sucking the mother's teat, who wants what it wants
in full expectation that it will continue to be fed and nurtured
unconditionally regardless of the outcome. This sort of "citizen"
wants a state that will treat her like her mother did. Hence the
maternalistic state.


Monday, October 5, 2015,
7:28:01 PM, you wrote:

In a message dated 10/5/2015 9:51:40 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time,  
lawrencehelm@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx writes: they don't know how to get at the  
constellations
or presuppositions we all walk around with, nor the  emotional nuances a
considerable number of which we don't even  notice.

I see. I was just amused at the phrase, 'maternalistic state',  since -- I
haven't checked, but I should (*), it seems the idea is that the  state is
paternalistic. Then I got into thinking that if the paternalistic, you
wouldn't have teats, figuratively. One thing led to the other. Google says it
gives "Circa 18.600 risultati (0,40 secondi)" for "paternalistic state". For
"maternalistic state", rather, Google gives "Circa 169 risultati (0,47
secondi)".

Mmm. Let's check the first hit. It reads: "Kristol noted that  in a
maternalistic state, the nation’s poor are practically commanded, from on  
high, to
stay disadvantaged and pitiable. The mother state does not want her  
children to grow up and live fulfilling, self-determining lives because she
enjoys their abject dependency entirely too much. The maternalistic state has
no
real solution for economic scarcity. In fact, it demands and requires a
lasting  and permanent poverty, a lower class which will forever depend on the
largess of  the government."
 
And so forth. Interesting.
 
Cheers,
 
Speranza

"Tit-sucker.  Yes, I like that.   Nietzsche  referred to him as the "last
man." -- Helm.

On 10/5/2015 4:41 PM,  Edward  Farrell wrote: "a spirit of entitlement at
the tit of a  all-pervasive,  maternalistic state.
 
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Edward W. Farrell
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