Re Phil's response:Thanks for taking the time to answer my question re how the Arab/Israeli conflict will end. Much of this I knew but somehow I hoped that ordinarily people would have a point at which some would say, "enough is enough." But I guess it will never happen. All in Salvationist religions are sort of stuck in the holy book, each of his own, that justice must be done. And it must come, one way or another. All delude themselves by not realizing how rare justice actually is.
Sadly, I am not quite in agreement with Phil. Being somewhat pessimistic, or realistic, I think it's only a matter of time before the nukes fly. And when that happens, the oil fields will go with them. And then, finally, some sort of peace will reign. Or maybe not. Then we will fight even more but for food. But without the oil, we will all live in the manner of people in the Middle Ages. Except using horses as transport will be impossible, as there are too many of us. In the meanwhile, since Arabs and Palestinians think it's all our fault, we can probably look forward to more attacks on Americans whenever and wherever possible
Veronica Canley Milford, MI----- Original Message ----- From: "Phil Enns" <phil.enns@xxxxxxxxx>
To: <lit-ideas@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Saturday, September 10, 2011 6:08 PMSubject: [lit-ideas] Re: Muslims (plural) disrupt Israeli philharmonic concert for Dutch Queen
Veronica Caley wrote:"I am very interested in how [the Palestinian/Israel conflict] is going to end."There are strong incentives for virtually all the actors in the region to make sure that the conflict does not end. 1. The Palestinian Authority is thoroughly corrupt and with the creation of a Palestinian state there would be tremendous pressure from donor countries that this corruption come to an end. Also, the PA would be forced to run free and fair elections and the outcome of these elections would no doubt see many of those currently in power, thrown out, and perhaps even punished for crimes they have committed. 2. Hamas identifies itself as a resistance movement and the removal of its raison d'etre would likely cause a splintering along the various ideological fault lines that currently exist within the movement. Once the common bond of resistance is gone, the different Islamic hardline and nationalist groups would turn all those guns against each other. What comes after Hamas? 3. Israel - Any final agreement would require the Israeli government to give up land it now controls, land that a powerful minority of settler groups and hardline Orthodox Jews consider integral to Israel. Such an agreement would be political suicide for any Israeli government and most likely lead to splits within the Israeli armed forces. There would be a considerable number of Israeli soldiers who would refuse to obey orders to remove Jews from land that many Jews consider to be part of Israel. Could Israel survive? 4. Egypt - What was true before the fall of Mubarak, but is now even more an issue, Egyptian authorities do not want to have a radicalized Islamic presence on its borders. The fear is that a Palestinian state with a hardline Islamic government would aid and encourage Islamic extremists in Egypt. Under Mubarak, Egypt was quite happy to have Israel keep the Palestinian militants in check and maintain the blockade along its border. Now, the Egyptian authorities are in a far more difficult situation, having to give the appearance to its citizens of giving more support to Palestinians without that support actually benefiting those groups which could be a threat to stability in Egypt. For the powers that be in Egypt, it is far better that the status quo in the Palestinian Territories be maintained. 5. Hezbollah - Much like Hamas, Hezbollah has its raison d'etre in being a resistance movement. Much of its funding comes from Iran and its long term strategic goals are made in consultation with Iran, so as long as Iran is committed to maintaining the Palestinian conflict, Hezbollah has a strong incentive to keep the conflict alive. Furthermore, in Lebanon, Hezbollah defines itself as a resistance movement against Israel, defending both Lebanon and Palestinians. While Hezbollah has made significant moves towards becoming a responsible actor in Lebanese politics, it continues to use the resistance card in order to safeguard its position in Lebanese society. 6. Syria - With regards to Israel, Syria has two primary interests: the return of the Golan Heights and maintaining influence in Lebanon. One of the negotiating points for Syria is the offer of reducing support for Palestinian militants in exchange for the Golan Heights. As long as Israel hangs on to the Golan Heights, the Syrians will want to put pressure on the Israelis by supporting the Palestinians and encouraging conflict. Also, the Syrians have influence with Hezbollah, with many Hezbollah leaders living in Damascus. Through Hezbollah, Syria is able to exercise influence in Lebanon, which Syria sees as within its sphere of control. A Palestinian/Israeli agreement would considerably weaken Hezbollah which in turn would weaken the influence of Syria in Lebanon. 7. Iran - To Muslims around the world, Iran presents itself as a revolutionary movement defending the Islamic world. The Palestinian/Israeli conflict is the most obvious example of this revolutionary activity. Iran has been the primary source of supplying weapons and training to Palestinian militants. The continuation of this conflict allows Iran to maintain its street cred in the Islamic world. It also serves to distract Iranians from the increasingly difficult conditions in Iran. The continuing spread of the Arab Spring in combination with a resolution of the Palestinian/Israeli conflict would be a nightmare for Iranian authorities. 8. Other Middle East countries - For several decades now, Arab leaders have used the Palestinian/Israeli conflict as a distraction from their own corruption and failings. The fear is that once this bogeyman is gone, Arab people might turn their attention to improving the conditions in their own country. The Arab Spring has led many Arabs to demand changes in their countries. A resolution of the Palestinian/Israeli conflict would only contribute to this tsunami sweeping the region. Unless the dynamics in the region radically change, I don't see much hope of a resolution. There are just too many strong incentives to keep the conflict going and not enough to bring about peace. Sincerely, Phil Enns ------------------------------------------------------------------ To change your Lit-Ideas settings (subscribe/unsub, vacation on/off, digest on/off), visit www.andreas.com/faq-lit-ideas.html
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