[jhb] Re: More on FS2020
- From: Fred Stopforth <fredstopforth@xxxxxxxxxx>
- To: "jhb@xxxxxxxxxxxxx" <jhb@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Fri, 4 Oct 2019 19:20:40 +0000
Hey lads make sure he doesn't put that polluted rum back in the bottle and in
the Mess bar. It'll only be fit to give it to that mangy dog at the door. Fred
D207
________________________________
From: jhb-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <jhb-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> on behalf of Bones
<bones@xxxxxxx>
Sent: 04 October 2019 19:00
To: jhb@xxxxxxxxxxxxx <jhb@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [jhb] Re: More on FS2020
Silently weeps in my rum… ☺
Bones
bones@xxxxxxx
From: jhb-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:jhb-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of ;
Mike Lucas
Sent: 04 October 2019 18:36
To: jhb@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [jhb] Re: More on FS2020
I hate to put one over on MikeB but I'm one of the lucky b***s who has 300 Mbps
download + 50 Mbps upload - and that's without full fttp! The BT cable cabinet
is more or less outside my house so there's only the last few metres of copper.
Mike L
On Fri, 4 Oct 2019 at 15:19, Mike Brook
<pot.holer@xxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:pot.holer@xxxxxxxxxxx>> wrote:
Oh Bones, you really do have my sympathy…! I wouldn’t dream of mentioning that
here in Warwickshire I currently get fttp 150 Mbps download and 30 Mbps upload
and that BT have even offered me 300+ Mbps download (which I’ve turned down).
Sorry…!
Best wishes to all we few JHB flyers left 😉
MikeB
From: jhb-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:jhb-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
<jhb-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:jhb-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>> On Behalf Of Bones
Sent: 01 October 2019 18:08
To: jhb@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:jhb@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [jhb] Re: More on FS2020
Not much chance for me then.
They recently announced we were getting an upgrade to our connections. When the
day came I ran the usual tests and yep, we got 2MBps rather than 1.. ☺
You can all stop laughing too….
Bones
bones@xxxxxxx<mailto:bones@xxxxxxx>
From: jhb-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:jhb-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
[mailto:jhb-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Mike Lucas
Sent: 01 October 2019 17:21
To: jhb@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<mailto:jhb@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [jhb] Re: More on FS2020
I'm going to ignore all the sumptuous visuals for now because I can see
that a huge amount of work with Bing was needed to build a full 3D world
from mapping data. I shall ignore the atmospherics too despite them looking
more >> realistic than anything I have seen previously.
What sort of horsepower will be necessary to render this quality of scenery and
weather? I imagine the demo was running on something pretty powerful and
beyond what is readily available to Joe Public and his budget. In addition,
the internet connection speed required to deliver the data to be rendered
locally will probably need to be FTTP Gbps rather than Mbps.
And, as Bones hints in his penultimate paragraph, likely to be a pricing model
which will be a tiered monthly subscription like a lot of business software.
It'll take a lot to prise me away from XP11 ...
Mike L
PS - Bones: I've just seen the flooding in Laxey - hope you still have your
head above water in Castletown.
On Tue, 1 Oct 2019 at 15:09, Bones <bones@xxxxxxx<
mailto:bones@xxxxxxx>> wrote:
I wonder if MS have used any of their development of FSX in FS2020 or did they
relinquish all that to Lockheed for Prepare 3D? If this is a new from the
ground up sim it will be fascinating to see what has changed.
I'm going to ignore all the sumptuous visuals for now because I can see that a
huge amount of work with Bing was needed to build a full 3D world from mapping
data. I shall ignore the atmospherics too despite them looking more realistic
than anything I have seen previously. Moving back to aircraft it may take some
time to make all new ones, their cockpits and the performances - and heavy
metal may be lagging in the development process. It may be a question of
relative speeds and render times but at high level I would have thought ground
data would be rendered at a lower LOD, or set to a limited render distance.
Back when we were making the England and Wales VFR scenery each object had a
default render distance. With most scenery it was not necessary to alter the
default draw distance as things would pop up in sensible sequence as the
aircraft moved forward. When you got to a very dense scenery area, like an
airport, we found in testing that a PC could get slammed with a sudden demand
for object rendering so, to reduce any sudden drop in FPS, we started to change
the DD for each airport object, small things like runway lights and direction
boards being given much lower DD than runways or buildings.
But maybe not, for as I wrote that I recall very well that even in a cruise at
FL250 the detail down on the ground is startlingly clear so render distance
would need to stay sharp at that height. Cruising at FL410 you still see good
detail though not actually pick out individual houses, so a slight drop in LOD
could be acceptable.
If the focus has been on getting the scenery working may the teams (if any
exist) for aircraft, ATC and missions are still working away at them. Again I
wonder if these are all new teams as I cannot see, after all this time, and
original FSX guys still around - or willing to go back after being laid off
after FSX had the rug pulled..
With an entirely new system it is quite feasible that FS would come as a basic
package and that any aircraft, missions or ATC may be extra purchases to
download. Considering the cost of making this 3D Earth model, and the hint that
it may constantly be updated as Bing updates their satellite imagery the
concept of rolling purchases becomes a feasible consideration to keep capital
pouring in..
All conjecture but it's fun to speculate- even when you know you are going to
be completely wrong.:)
Bones
bones@xxxxxxx<
mailto:bones@xxxxxxx>
From: jhb-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<
mailto:jhb-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
[
mailto:jhb-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<
mailto:jhb-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>] On Behalf Of
paul@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx<
mailto:paul@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: 01 October 2019 14:17
To: jhb@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<
mailto:jhb@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Subject: [jhb] Re: More on FS2020
Although I posted links to Airboyd's videos there were a whole bunch of videod
released by different bloggers on YouTube yesterday. They all feature the same
in game footage and talk about their experience of being given early access.
Though, for me, the more telling part was the developers Q&A. The key point
being the guy from Microsoft saying he was not being constrained by Microsoft
and their intention was to develop a flight simulator, not a game, aimed at the
hard core sim fan that has supported them over the last 40 years. He was keen
to emphasise they were open to working with developers to bring in suggestions
and envisaged continued development over 10 years. He also emphasised that
although they first announced it at E3 they weren't happy that it gave the
wrong impression they were aiming the product at the XBox community.
One thing that stood out though was the focus on VFR in the video they
released. Those attending (I've watched several other bloggers versions) talk
about there being no or very little ATC at the moment and no air traffic. The
lack of heavy metal developed so far and available to the bloggers is unusual
for MS. Rendering issues once the airspeed increases? There was also mention of
adding in support for third party ATC, helicopters and military. That led me to
wonder whether they would be added in later or on release. While checklists and
new user training was mentioned, another thing not mentioned specifically in
the videos I've seen was whether this release would include missions or not.
Given the level of detail they're putting into the visual elements, doing so
would be a no brainervin my opinion.
Paul Reynolds
Sent from my Huawei phone
-------- Original Message --------
Subject: [jhb] Re: More on FS2020
From: Bones
To: jhb@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<
mailto:jhb@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
CC:
Fascinating the way FS has evolved.
We started with a split screen showing a cockpit in the lower half of the
screen and a very minimalistic outside view in the top half. What little CPU
power we had drove the aerodynamics engine and the resultant readouts on the
dials. Further versions saw visuals evolve, both outside and inside the
aircraft. Then photoscenery burst upon us and outside realism exploded, both in
scenery realism and atmospheric realism.
This new version seems to be a fully rendered and accurate globe with an
aircraft on top. :) Nothing wrong in that as the scenery is in the cloud and
streamed (I've been working in SL for 10 years which does the same thing). In
fact the same issue affects both in that density of scenery increases render
times and lag and so designers need to make accurate mesh objects yet with as
low a poly count as possible to minimise GPU/CPU load.
The visual are stunning and I think that is what the biggest selling point will
be. I'm not sure if this is the first fully rendered globe in software (I'm
sadly not up to date with things) but that will be the draw for most. As the
guy himself said, the first thing he did was fly over his house (hands up
everyone) but then he said the exploration of the scenery took his thoughts
away from the aircraft and its performance. That is what I am curious about
because he kept calling it a game rather than a simulator. It makes me wonder
if the aerodynamics are improved too or have not moved on since FSX days - or
may be more basic.
I shall watch with interest. :)
Waves to everyone from a slightly wet island.
Bones
bones@xxxxxxx<
mailto:bones@xxxxxxx>
-----Original Message-----
From: jhb-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<
mailto:jhb-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
[
mailto:jhb-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx<
mailto:jhb-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>] On Behalf Of
Paul Reynolds
Sent: 30 September 2019 23:14
To: JHB Airlines
Subject: [jhb] More on FS2020
Some interesting videos posted on YouTube today...
Microsoft Flight Simulator 2020 • Global Preview Event:
https://youtu.be/mkMoZkGhIog<
https://eur03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fyoutu.be%2FmkMoZkGhIog&data=02%7C01%7C%7C815dadd8883a4ca91c7008d74691fe9d%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637055465161170882&sdata=8dCE%2FwK4upZj6uyRsrDpI6LcngDNZdhq2IUtD2qZ9QY%3D&reserved=0>
Developers Q&A
https://youtu.be/a-ppN8HjZGk<
https://eur03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fyoutu.be%2Fa-ppN8HjZGk&data=02%7C01%7C%7C815dadd8883a4ca91c7008d74691fe9d%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637055465161190892&sdata=tp0sZNtpg9eO2ldtVsBdP1rpjXOkneGhefTFC%2BSwjVc%3D&reserved=0>
Paul Reynolds
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