[THIN] Re: TSCALE or Appsense

  • From: "Bernd Harzog" <berndh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • To: <thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
  • Date: Sun, 7 Jan 2007 21:07:37 -0500

Hi Rick,

I thought I was done explaining dynamic DLL rebasing when I left RTO, but I
guess I get to do it one more time :-).

As you point out, post-compilation rebasing has existed more or less since
the advent of Windows. There is even a utility for developers called the
rebase utility that does it.

The trick (and the thing that RTO patented), was not the act of implementing
different base addresses than what the developer originally chose (or chose
not to choose), but to figure out the optimal set of base addresses given
what is running on a particular machine. The process is in fact iterative,
and needs to be continuously, since any new DLL or new version of an
existing DLL can cause the optimal locations of N other DLLs to change.

Other than the small technical detail above, and the legal implications
thereof, I agree with all of your other comments.

Angela, if you are not into the arcane art of memory management on Windows
Servers, in English this means that if you own a version of Citrix that
includes memory and CPU optimization, try these free features before you buy
a product that implements a superset of these free features. If you do not
own a version of Citrix that includes these features, follow Rick?s advice,
but be aware that if you by AppSense?s product you MAY be forced to either
stop using the VM optimization features, or be left without support for them
if legal action on the part of RTO or Citrix is taken against AppSense.


Bernd Harzog
VP Business Development

-----Original Message-----
From: thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]On Behalf
Of Rick Mack
Sent: Sunday, January 07, 2007 7:39 PM
To: thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [THIN] Re: TSCALE or Appsense

Hi Bernd,

Mea culpa.

I either didn't realise or had forgotten that RTO Software have a patent on
dynamic DLL rebasing. I was certainly aware that RTO pioneered DLL rebasing
but I guess I assumed that since the concept of post-compilation DLL
rebasing predated TScale, that RTO had "simply" (sorry) done some brilliant
and innovative work in putting together an automated rebasing solution. I
think TScale is great, but that's not the whole story.

Your comments on the patent certainly change the landscape somewhat, though
I'm surprised that RTO hasn't taken some action against AppSense.

My recommendation to Angela re using AppSense as opposed to TScale made the
assumption that if you wanted to buy TScale you don't have PS4 Enterprise,
because as you pointed out, user interface aside, Citrix' memory
optimization software is an OEMed version of TScale. Why buy what you've
already got. Similarly with AppSense for CPU management.

All other things being equal, and disregarding patent infrigements etc for
the moment, AppSense is significantly more feature-rich with regard to
memory optimization than TScale. It will save you more memory (virtual and
physical) than DLL rebasing alone.

On the CPU side of things Appsense provides cpu affinity control (which you
can also do with an application compatibility fix), CPU clamping at a
process level, thread level priority control, user and group based resource
control etc. In comparison to Armtech, it has more useful features.

If you didn't have a CPU/Memory optimization productand had a choice between
TScale and Amtech or AppSense, AppSense would make more sense.



Ulrich Mack
Commander Australia

On 1/8/07, Bernd Harzog < berndh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx
<mailto:berndh@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx> > wrote:
Hi Angela,

Some up front disclosure before I offer my opinion. I used to be the CEO of
RTO Software, and personally did the deal to OEM the memory management
features of TScale to Citrix, which are now the memory optimization features
of CPS 4. So, before you buy either product, enable this feature on one of
your servers and see what it does.

Another word of caution. RTO holds the patent for dynamic DLL rebasing (the
technical term for moving the code pages of the DLL's that comprise an
application around so that they can be shared instead of having two copies
of the code pages for each user). Since RTO has licensed this technology and
the patent to Citrix, Citrix is now a holder of the patent as well. Appsense
are remarketing DLL rebasing in violation of this patent. All RTO or Citrix
have to do is file suit, and they will get an injunction that forces
AppSense to stop shipping Optimizer in the States (countries other than the
USA are a different story). So, I would suggest that you not buy AppSense
for the DLL remapping since you can get that legally for free as a part of
CPS 4.0. If you want to buy AppSense for the other memory management
features that Rick Mack alluded to, those are not covered by the patent and
you are safe.


Bernd Harzog
VP Business Development
www.proactivewatch.com <http://www.proactivewatch.com>
bharzog@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx <mailto:bharzog@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>

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