I think that you need to sit down a read a good solid book on Group Policy Objects.. You don't have to kill explorer.exe.. You can push Mandatory Profiles onto people, GPO's to hide everything on their desktop, and then tell the session what apps to launch. All through GPOs. As for load balancing, yes, 2000 TS can do this with Advanced Server. Like someone else mentioned, it's not resource based.. You just tell each node what percentage of users to handle. As for advantages that Citrix has over TS? I couldn't tell you, I've never worked with Citrix.. But I do know that for my environment (two offices, 500 people in each, 6 servers in each), Terminal Services does everything I want, at a MUCH cheaper price than Citrix... As for pushing shortcuts to desktops, with VBScript, I can push a shortcut into every copy of every profile in a site (3500 instances of that shortcut) in about 5 minutes, and it shows up in real time. There's ways to do most everything you need to do, it's just a matter of whether you want to take the time to learn to do it, or you'd rather just spend the money to have someone else write a pretty little interface for it. From my reading, the only thing I would see as useful is the size of the ICA protocol vs the RDP protocol (16k vs 48k per session, respectively). That's what presently restricting me to ~85 users per server are my pipes... -----Original Message----- From: Evan Mann [mailto:emann@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2004 6:01 PM To: thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [THIN] Re: Citrix VS Terminal services, what's the difference? I had a 1 MF XP1.0 FR2 server at my old company and here I have 4 Windows 2000 Terminal servers. No big farm where I needed load balancing and things like that, just basic systems. My biggest complaint of not having a client like PN Agent or Nfuse (called something else now, forgot the name) where I can give certain users access to specific apps only, and force it upon them. If I want to force an app on a user with terminal server, I have to do it with the environment tab in AD Users/Computers, or create an RDP using the program line. Most of my users need access to 2 or more apps. I DO NOT want to publish a desktop so I need multiple RDPs. That's anightmare to maintain for many users, and on top of it, unless I restrict the NTFS permission on an RDP, they can disable the program that is being launched. With PN Agent, I can push shortcuts right to their desktop and make it seamless. With Nfuse, I tell them to go to a webpage, and based on their username, they are shown the links for what apps they need. Set it to run seamless and the user doesn't even know they arein another machine. =20 Right now, with 2000 terminal server, my programmer creates a customized app that kills explorer.exe and shows them the select shortcuts for apps they need. It's much more managable, but still far from the management Citrix offers. Which is my other biggest missing piece, the managability of what users can access what apps, on a per user, and more importantly, on a group, level. Terminal Server is not as functional as Citrix, IF you need those extra features. If you find you aren't using them, why pay the extra $$? -----Original Message----- From: thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:thin-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of John Van Gerpen Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2004 5:32 PM To: thin@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Subject: [THIN] Citrix VS Terminal services, what's the difference?=20 I administrate Windows 2000 network and Citrix Medaframe XP. Looking at CO$T$ and maintenance associated with Citrix I'm considering scrapping Citrix and going with a Terminal services RDP environment. All my clients are WinXP and Wyse terminals (RDP). The only down side I know is the load balancing Citrix can do, and Terminal services cannot. What do you think the advantages and disadvantages are between RDP & ICA?=20 Is Terminal services as functional as Citrix? Thanks in advance John. ******************************************************** This Week's Sponsor - Tarantella Secure Global Desktop Tarantella Secure Global Desktop Terminal Server Edition Free Terminal Service Edition software with 2 years maintenance. http://www.tarantella.com/ttba ********************************************************** Useful Thin Client Computing Links are available at: http://thin.net/links.cfm *********************************************************** For Archives, to Unsubscribe, Subscribe or set Digest or Vacation mode use the below link: http://thin.net/citrixlist.cfm ******************************************************** This Week's Sponsor - Tarantella Secure Global Desktop Tarantella Secure Global Desktop Terminal Server Edition Free Terminal Service Edition software with 2 years maintenance. http://www.tarantella.com/ttba ********************************************************** Useful Thin Client Computing Links are available at: http://thin.net/links.cfm *********************************************************** For Archives, to Unsubscribe, Subscribe or set Digest or Vacation mode use the below link: http://thin.net/citrixlist.cfm This email and any files transmitted with it are confidential and intended solely for the use of the individual or entity to whom they are addressed. 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