Greetings All: Based on the comments of an anonymous gull expert recruited to review our e-bird records of a second winter Lesser Black-backed Gull on 12/24/13 and a first winter California Gull on 12/25/13 - both at Lake Ridge Golf Course - it appears that over-reliance on field guides rife with errors and inadequate knowledge about potential size variation in the 'American' Herring Gull led at least two observers (including myself) down the primrose path to misidentification of subadult gulls. This is not the first time this will happen and probably not the last? Reviewing the comments of the gull expert and several specialty websites on gull identification, we focussed too much on ruling out Ring-billed Gull and didn't pay enough consideration to the fact that some 'smithsonianus' Herring Gulls can be scarce larger than Ring-billed Gulls and are potentially confused with some of the so-called mid-sized gulls. Apparently, we should have been a tad more focussed on ruling out Herring Gull! This certainly seems to be the case with the California Gull - neither the description or the photographs obtained rule out an exceptionally small Herring Gull. This is a bit less the case with the Lesser Black-backed Gull - some described traits are inconsistent for Lesser Black-backed Gull (particularly the bill color - misillustrated in just about every field guide out there as bicolored) and some described traits are inconsistent with Herring Gull - but there is enough confusion in the description to warrant rejection by e-bird and by the ABA compiler for the region. Consequently, both records will be rejected. I am also in the process of reviewing previous reports of California Gull and Lesser Black-backed Gull from the LEAS region in order to cull any potentially bad records. I suspect that most of the first winter records will survive the process but there is a good chance that all second winter records will be, at the minimum, asterisked. The moral of the story: there is nothing worse than trying to identify first and second winter birds with the conventional field guides in hand. Off to find a better gull guide suggestions would be appreciated. Anthony 'Fat Tony' Hewetson; Lubbock Edit your Freelists account settings for TEXBIRDS at //www.freelists.org/list/texbirds Reposting of traffic from TEXBIRDS is prohibited without seeking permission from the List Owner