[TechAssist] Re: use a battery backup UPS for TV,DVD,surround amp system protection ?

From: "Wayne Vanaman" <Wayne@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <techassist@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Date: Fri, 7 May 2004 17:00:14 -0500
Ty and all:

As far as running on DC, sure, it may be possible.  Consider  that the
bridge diodes are rated for a changing value of current, and thus have a
chance to cool.  If you draw all of the current only thru one diode it will
have to be a Big diode.

Now, as far as the voltage, if the power supply is optimised for 120VAC
60Hz, when your voltage gets low, the power supply will run harder, hotter,
and will fail early.  Some of the TrippLite DC to AC inverters I have seen
run 120 VAC by switching +-60 DC (square wave).  This is will only give that
pump up cap that is looking for 160, 60.  The power supply may not run at
all, and if it does it is gonna be hot.

As for stepped sign waves, every time you "step" you create a level edge,
which generates haromonics.  If you are looking to induce lots of harmonics
into the power supply prepare for all kinds of crazy problems in the
operation due to the harmonics interferring with the clock/data signals.

What if you micro is looking for that 60Hz for timing.  Again, those edges
may trick the micro.

The APC Smart UPS line, at least the ones I have seen over 400VA, is a true
sine wave output.  Refurbed units are available here:

https://www.refurbups.com/default.asp

at a fraction of the "new" cost.

Wayne Vanaman
Omega Electronics
6904 W Fairfield Dr
Pensacola, Fl.  32506-3310

Wayne@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
WWW.PensacolaTVRepair.Com

850-456-5995 voice
850-458-6369 fax


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Ty" <ty1k@xxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <techassist@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Friday, May 07, 2004 3:23 PM
Subject: [TechAssist] Re: use a battery backup UPS for TV,DVD,surround amp
system protection ?


> This question has me intrigued. Why is it being debated by proficient
> electronic technicians?
> OK. MODERN televisions, VCRs, DVDs, anything with a pulse power supply.
> Reasoning that modern Pulse Power supplies essentially run on DC, I was
> wondering what difference it makes what kind of sign, square, or whatever,
> wave gets rectified in order to charge the primary filter capacitor. As
long
> as the filter is charged to the critical starting voltage and is
maintained.
> Of course, you will have to raise the input to meet the output criteria.
> Heck, you can use DC for input and you can even ignore the polarity due to
> the bridge!.
> Mmmmm....
> Take a voltage reading on the main filter cap under full load.
> Connect a bunch of batteries to attain the voltage. Connect it across the
> filter and you got your problem solved. Instant UPS. Of course, you will
> have to modify the ON/OFF switch. Another problem is charging inrush. Use
a
> diode and resistor combination. Heck, we can figure it out!
> Now the 10 lb transformer in a power amplifier or in the Microwave is
> another story, but not impossible if batteries are used after the
> transformer. Storage would be a problem. Where would you store enough
> batteries to power a Magnetron and finish cooking that turkey.
> Lets see. Move the holyday dishes to the basement, move the regular dishes
> to where the holyday dishes were, and WALLA!  LOOK OUT TURKEY!
> Just realized the biggest obstacle to my simple idea. How am I going to
get
> the wife to allow me to drill a hole in the countertop...
>
> Have fun! >(;o)
>
> Ty
>
> Tiberius Kraemer
> BLUE STAR ELECTRONICS
> 3312 Silverton Rd. NE
> Salem, Oregon
> Phone: 503 391 1491
> Mailto:ty1k@xxxxxxxxxxx
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: techassist-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> [mailto:techassist-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]On Behalf Of Phil Bader
> Sent: Friday, May 07, 2004 11:44 AM
> To: techassist@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: [TechAssist] Re: use a battery backup UPS for TV,DVD,surround
> amp system protection ?
>
>
> Shoot, jerry why are your facts so depressing!
> Seriously, I called APC, and the tech said the "stepped sine wave"
> versions may not work satisfactorily with , say, an engraving machine
> (My next door neighbor has a trophy shop). he suggested their better
> Smart UPS line, I think its called.Anyway, it would be sort of self
> defeating to destroy the very thing you are wanting to protect...
> Phil Bader
>
> J Silverman wrote:
>
> >The computer power supplies work fine with the 115 VAC (RMS) square wave
> >output from the low cost UPSs. Most consumer electronic equipment is
rated
> >for 115 volt RMS 60 Hertz sine wave, plus or minus 10%. If you use the
> >computer UPS with consumer electronic equipment the internal voltages and
> >losses are different than the spec., so you are not sure if you will have
> >functional problems or if things will overheat. A lot of stuff will
> probably
> >work OK, but you cant be sure. So the suggestion was made to use UPSs
that
> >have a sine wave output and these are many times more expensive than the
> >ones with a square wave output.
> >
> >Jerry Silverman
> >Greentron Inc
> >4 Newland Ave
> >Greenville SC 29609
> >864 232 3889
> >Fax 271 2080
> >mailto:greentron@xxxxxxx
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: "Kevin" <kevintv@xxxxxxx>
> >To: <techassist@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >Sent: Friday, May 07, 2004 5:30 AM
> >Subject: [TechAssist] Re: use a battery backup UPS for TV,DVD,surround
amp
> >system protection ?
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >>Using a UPS for a computer is also designed to save what a person is
> >>working on at the time of a power outage.  When the power goes out the
> >>computer stays on and the person can save his work and then shut the
> >>computer down properly.  In some cases it will also prevent data from
> >>being corrupted on the hard drive when the power goes out.  Having the
> >>power outage causes windows to shut down improperly, which could corrupt
> >>data on the hard drive.
> >>
> >>Kevin Wilks
> >>Kevin's TV & Video Repair
> >>Penticton BC Canada
> >>kevintv@xxxxxxx
> >>
> >>
> >>-----Original Message-----
> >>From: techassist-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >>[mailto:techassist-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf Of Hoyt's TV
> >>Sent: Friday, April 30, 2004 2:11 PM
> >>To: techassist@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >>Subject: [TechAssist] Re: use a battery backup UPS for TV,DVD,surround
> >>amp system protection ?
> >>
> >>Considering the price of some TVs and stereos these days, I'm surprised
> >>they
> >>don't push UPS's for those, like they do for computers. Computers were
> >>the
> >>first things that were overly sensitive but TVs etc. have now caught up.
> >>
> >>
> >>Russ Hoyt
> >>Hoyt's TV
> >>Exeter, NH
> >>
> >>
> >>----- Original Message -----
> >>From: "Larry Poffen" <lpoffen@xxxxxxx>
> >>To: <techassist@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >>Sent: Friday, April 30, 2004 3:46 PM
> >>Subject: [TechAssist] Re: use a battery backup UPS for TV,DVD,surround
> >>amp
> >>system protection ?
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>>I have used a APC 1000 for my personal stuff for about 2 years.  I had
> >>>
> >>>
> >>a
> >>
> >>
> >>>power surge that took it out this year, along with many other things,
> >>>
> >>>
> >>but
> >>my
> >>
> >>
> >>>36" TV  &VCR/  stereo stuff were all OK.  It is worth the peace of
> >>>
> >>>
> >>mind.
> >>
> >>
> >>>Larry
> >>>
> >>>Larrys TV Service
> >>>Broken Arrow OK 74011
> >>>phone 918-455-1041
> >>>Fax 918-451-4485
> >>>e-mail lpoffen@xxxxxxx
> >>>----- Original Message -----
> >>>From: "Phil Bader" <tjanphyl@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >>>To: <techassist@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
> >>>Sent: Friday, April 30, 2004 9:06 AM
> >>>Subject: [TechAssist] use a battery backup UPS for TV,DVD,surround amp
> >>>system protection ?
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>I never heard of anyone doing this, but I've had this thought for a
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>few
> >>
> >>
> >>>>years:
> >>>>use a heavy battery back up UPS like used on PC systems for an
> >>>>entertainment center. Many ills are from power
> >>>>fluctuations,sags,surges,etc. TV EEPROMs corrupted, power supplies
> >>>>damaged, pro-jo CRTs damaged with  a spot because it went down at
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>once
> >>
> >>
> >>>>without proper power down,etc.
> >>>>Most equipement is not a heavy current draw.
> >>>>Can this be done and should it?
> >>>>I have a Zenith 50" projection TV (not wide screen,standard 3:4)
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>which
> >>
> >>
> >>>>is rated at 215 watts (2.8A) "max".
> >>>> I think my VCR/DVD deck pulls maybe 30 watts.
> >>>>My Bose "lifestyle 7" surround amp, I don't know the wattage.
> >>>>And a cable box maybe another 30 watts?
> >>>>I'm guessing 300-400 watts max running everything
> >>>> if using the sound system as well. Much less if using only the
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>projo's
> >>
> >>
> >>>>speakers.
> >>>>Now most of these UPS units are in standby mode and  the connected
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>gear
> >>
> >>
> >>>>is running off line current until there is a power loss, which time
> >>>>ultra-fast switching transferrs power to the battery system. This
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>would
> >>
> >>
> >>>>be only needed for intermittant power fluctuations, or if lost
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>totally,
> >>
> >>
> >>>>enough time to safely power off the audio/video system.
> >>>>A 6 outlet power strip plugged into the UPS would be convenient.
> >>>>What would be a good power rating for a UPS?
> >>>>Twice needed wattage? whats rule of thumb, and also whats your
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>feedback
> >>
> >>
> >>>>on this idea?
> >>>>Phil Bader
> >>>>
> >>>>--
> >>>>
> >>>>Philip Bader
> >>>>Jan Phyl TV Inc. (estab. 1976)
> >>>>3420 Recker Hwy. Winter Haven, Fl. 33880
> >>>>Fax (863) 299-8821
> >>>>email: tjanphyl@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>
>
>
>
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References:
- [TechAssist] Re: use a battery backup UPS for TV,DVD,surround amp system protection ?
  - From: Ty
[TechAssist] Re: use a battery backup UPS for TV,DVD,surround amp system protection ?

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