Tommy, I understand what you are saying...there are some problems you need a schematic for. Also, anyone relying on tips programs will not make it. No tip program will have every fault for a model listed. I think about half the time I look for something in a database, it is not there and I have to find a print, or go to you guys for help. I repair a lot of sets without a schematic and even more now without resorting to a database. Anyone who goes to a tip program before troubleshooting, is only hurting themselves. I find all the new circuits intriguing and do my best to understand them either on my own, or from the help of you guys. Jeff FAX 717-564-4952 Intrepid Video & Electronics 501 Luther Rd Harrisburg PA 17111-2055 Be careful of your thoughts. They may become your words any moment. Order your tip CD today. Filled with TV, VCR, camcorder tips and more. Version 3.0, ready, with more tips, user friendly program. $49.00 for CD, plus first year of tip updates. sales@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx for more info www.tech-repair.net www.intrepid-video.com www.thetoolcaddy.com www.9-11-2001tragedy.com ******************************************************************** ----- Original Message ----- From: <Hermantvr@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> To: <techassist@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Sunday, October 20, 2002 6:59 AM Subject: [TechAssist] Re: for the record + repairing without a schematic? Yes, Jeff...I know about TriTronics...I use them daily. My argument is that to truly troubleshoot a chassis you do need service data. I agree that years of experience helps to repair a lot of electronics without pulling out service manuals, however it seems to me that too many young technicians are relying on data base and a quick fix to repair electronics today, True troubleshooting skills are being overlooked. I am as guilty as anyone. I use some sort of data base daily, it is necessary for us to turn out enough repairs to keep our bills paid maybe even have something left over for a cold one once in a while. The ESR meter helps but troubleshooting shutdown and horizontal problems not to mention switch mode power supplies ...well service data is necessary. Some of Hitachi's chassis have as many as 14 shutdown circuits. I would find it difficult...no impossible to repair a chassis like that without service data. Maybe I am just a little dumber that the average tech....but I am what I am, and I need service data. I know there is a lot of different opinions on the subject, but the only reason I mentioned it in the first place is because I think the new and beginner technicians should concentrate on troubleshooting skills. Tommy Herman Herman TV 250 School Ave SW Taylorsville, N.C. 28681 828-632-5322 Voice 828-632-3880 Fax hermantvr@xxxxxxxxxxxxx n a message dated 10/20/02 12:17:52 AM Eastern Daylight Time, support@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx writes: Tommy, Not necessarily. www.tritronicsinc.com list many models on their site as well as OEM numbers for most parts. This is an ideal site for finding OEM numbers. Jeff ----- Original Message ----- From: <Hermantvr@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> To: <techassist@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> Sent: Saturday, October 19, 2002 7:37 PM Subject: [TechAssist] Re: for the record + repairing without a schematic? Wow...only been at it for around 15 years, but I find I NEED schematics. As a matter of fact ...I very seldom take in a TV if I don't have a schematic or have access to one. Working on TV's without service data is guess work. Part values are more critical today than they were years ago. Proper service data is necessary just to get the original part #. Tommy Herman ------------------------------------------- Introducing NetZero Long Distance Unlimited Long Distance only $29.95/ month! Sign Up Today! www.netzerolongdistance.com ------------------------------------------ To REMOVE your email address, click here: http://www.tech-assist.org/unsubb.html To CHANGE your email address, click here: http://www.techassist.net/forms/change.html ------------------------------------------ ***NEW*** Tips Added Instantly!!!*** Submit Repair Tips here: http://www.tech-assist.org/secure/tip/