[tcb] Re: ideas for new engine for my 71 Westy
- From: "w.wood" <evil.scientist.boo@xxxxxxxxx>
- To: tcb@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
- Date: Fri, 13 Apr 2012 22:37:48 -0500
LOL, well this is one of those religious debates. I used to get schooled
by old St. Berg so pardon my praise be to the spirit of GBE...
1) It takes money to make power. Putting pistons and Cylinders on an ACVW
will get you more power up to a point but until you start putting out the
money for better flow (carbs, heads, intakes and exhaust) you'll just start
starving the engine. Not to mention the fact that if you get a cheap
bottom end with stock VW rods you're asking for trouble, even in an 1835.
2) The valve train is a very weak thing in a VW, if you put more power into
an ACVW you'll want to play a bit and the next thing you know... Ping there
goes a valve into the piston and then goes a rod and bam! So, if you're
going to make serious power get serious about the cylinder heads and stay
away from stock three keeper valves like the plague! Can you do it with
stock style heads? Sure but just don't expect them to last long with your
foot in it.
3) High rod angles mean going with the shortest rods possible with respects
to expected RPM ranges. If you want the most torque out of your engine,
calculating rod angles is critical. Most VW engine builders just put
things together to make sure it fits, however if you really want the torque
you may have to do some math and this is what most engine builders don't
do, the hard math.
4) I've seen too many of these HotVW engine builds and with good OEM parts
drying up, you'll have to rely on the aftermarket to supply the go fast
stuff. So, you may get 150 out of a 2007 but I'd like to see a bill of
materials as to what goes into it before I'd take it on a long trip.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piston_motion_equations
http://victorylibrary.com/mopar/rod-tech-c.htm
http://www.stahlheaders.com/Lit_Rod%20Length.htm
Oh and here's a close to 300HP ghia with a 2176 but no mention on how much
$$$ or boost is involved. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oBFACYEV6YI
Here's 235 on a 2332 with 16 Valve Heads.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&NR=1&v=3KERkb7SaH8 They're
only $4400/pair.. ;-)
I will tell you though, it's fun to get power out of these little four
cylinder engines but it comes at a price and beyond a certain point you'll
also have to ask yourself, like me, why do I have $5K in this 2387?
.. LOL
If HotVWs is trying to build something then they should try to reproduce
what Kawell did for them a few years ago, I believe he got up to 300HP on a
1915 build before he cracked the cylinders. I remember seeing a few of the
Kawell powered Turbo Busses back in the 80s at OCIR and they were hella
fast but not very long lived..
On Fri, Apr 13, 2012 at 10:05 PM, sammie smith <bugcollections@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> wrote:
> And Will, I agree with your equation for torque. Point is, you get lots
> of torque when you stroke it for the cc's vs. thinking you will get a lot
> of torque if you go the 1776 or 1835 route, which you don't. You need
> torque for the bus, not high rpm horsepower.
>
> ------------------------------
> *From:* w.wood <evil.scientist.boo@xxxxxxxxx>
> *To:* tcb@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> *Sent:* Fri, April 13, 2012 8:49:31 PM
> *Subject:* [tcb] Re: ideas for new engine for my 71 Westy
>
> Actually stroke + high rod angle = high torque... ;-)
>
> On a 2007, HP will be closer to 100 but then again what kind of heads will
> the engine have? That's where the power and the heat comes from ultimately.
>
>
>
> On Fri, Apr 13, 2012 at 4:40 PM, sammie smith <
> bugcollections@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote:
>
>> I vote for the Oakhill built 2007, either with one center mount weber
>> or dual, your preference. I have one in the Baja. Absolutely perfect
>> engine. Hot VWs is building a 2007 specifically for a bus (two part
>> article, first part is in the latest issue). Stroke gives you torque, and
>> that is what you need in a bus. One of our members also has one in his
>> blue single cab that was at the Nac show. He also loves his. Depending on
>> compression, cam, carbs etc. you are going to get 100 to 140 or so
>> horsepower with a lot of torque. Not sure what gear ratios are in a bay,
>> but you might want to look into what to do with the ratios in that tranny
>> to take advantage of the additional power. You are probably looking at
>> $3,500 plus for a long block from Oakhill, but you would have to talk to
>> Daniel Watts for specifics. I personally cannot say enough about how great
>> their 2007 is. I am working on turning 50,000 miles in mine which is in
>> the baja.
>>
>> ------------------------------
>> *From:* "71Westy@xxxxxxxxxxx" <71Westy@xxxxxxxxxxx>
>> *To:* TCB@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>> *Sent:* Fri, April 13, 2012 10:48:07 AM
>>
>> *Subject:* [tcb] ideas for new engine for my 71 Westy
>>
>> Looking at a real engine for my 71 Westy. Tired of putting in the
>> 1600DP.
>>
>>
>>
>> Would like reliabilty, torque and simplicity. At the NAC show , someone
>> told me to look into a 2007 cc with a progressive carb.Dual carbs are a
>> mystery to me so the notion of a single carb got my attention.
>>
>>
>>
>> Who builds those around here? Oakhill I think is who Greg mentioned.
>>
>>
>>
>> Other ideas welcomed for the engine. Anyone have a Westy with a 1776 in
>> it to test drive?
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks, Trey
>>
>
>
>
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