[tcb] Re: A very goofy gremlin
- From: Tracy <pepsifreek@xxxxxxxxxxx>
- To: <tcb@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Sun, 18 Dec 2011 08:50:03 -0600
Hey Julie, your loss of power and stalling might be a coil problem, well not
so much of a coil problem but a coil's not working sometimes because it's
stops getting power problem.
I just spent a minute looking at the 71 schematic.
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/archives/info/wiringt2.php
Starting at the Coil on the positive side ("15" on the schematic) follow
wire 1.5 BLK to terminal 10 on the fuse block which is provided 12v when the
ignition switch is in the on position.
Terminals 10, 11 and 12 are connected together and supply (ignition on) 12v
to the emergency flasher switch, the warning lights on the fuel gauge, the
windshield wiper switch, the rear window defogger switch, the brake
light/warning switch and the horn.
The wire 1.0 BLK/YEL goes from the top side of terminal 10 to the horn which
is grounded when you hit the horn.
Like you said, it's a bit "goofy" but that's the only way the ignition
system and the horn are connected.
From: tcb-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:tcb-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf
Of julie.hey.ho.lets.go@xxxxxxxxx
Sent: Sunday, December 18, 2011 7:04 AM
To: tcb@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [tcb] Re: A very goofy gremlin
Thanks Lee,
At least you don't think I am crazy.
On Sun, Dec 18, 2011 at 6:39 AM, Lee <robilee1@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Julie,
I also have a 71 and every time I have one of those oddball electrical
issues it turns out to be a cruddy or loose connection somewhere, so I think
you are on the right track with that. It is most often a bad ground
connection. The reason that the horn is probably fixing the problem is that
cruddy and loose connections get resistive. Chances are that when you toot
the horn the current flow from that is enough to temporarily break down that
resistance so the circuit works again.
I'm the world best mechanic, but I do know a bit about the electrical side
of the world having spent quite a few years working in that field. Bad
,grounds sometime produce very very weird symptoms. We once had a customer
whose computer crashed every time someone flushed the toilet and it turned
out that a recent plumbing repair had resulted in a short section of his
iron sewer line being replaced with PVC. Since his computer was grounded to
that iron pipe that was no longer actually grounded (PVC doesn't conduct
electricity) whenever a toilet was flushed the rushing water through the
line would temporarily bridge that PVC gap and the change in grounding
crashed his system. By comparison Donner's symptoms seem pretty straight
forward! Also, you mentioned not getting spark. That would have noting to do
with a fuel problem.
I don't normally participate in these discussions, but thought maybe on this
occasion I might be able to add something. Good luck. Finding a faulty
ground can be extremely difficult.
Regards,
Lee
Sent from my PDP-8
On Dec 18, 2011, at 6:05 AM, julie.hey.ho.lets.go@xxxxxxxxx wrote:
Twice when I couldn't start him I undid the fuel line from the carb and fuel
flowed through when trying to start him. He does not have a fuel problem.
And just to explain how I came about knowing that the horn is capable of
helping when I have starting problems, the first time that I couldn't start
him I checked for loose wires and anything else that could be the culprit.
I would fiddle around try to start him and he would turn over but not fire.
I tried the lights and the wipers and the horn just to see if the battery
was giving enough power or if they were wimpier than they should be. They
were fine. Right after trying the horn I tried starting him and he fired
right up. My mom was there with me and we laughed and laughed because it
seemed as if the horn had something to do with it but at that time I did
believe that it was a coincidence. When this gremlin appeared after that I
would try all of the other things I could think of, like loose wires and
checking the fuel flow... and then I said to myself, what the heck, try the
horn and bingo! After tooting the horn he would start. I was still
skeptical but I would thank my lucky stars and now that this has happened so
many times I know for a fact that somehow the horn works like a
defibrillator.
On Sat, Dec 17, 2011 at 10:35 PM, J Duncan <whocanduncan1@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Have you tried to override the horn's switch?
Still be it's fuel, or lack thereof.
On Sat, Dec 17, 2011 at 9:41 PM, <julie.hey.ho.lets.go@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Donner embodies the Christmas spirit (even though he was not named after a
reindeer but after the folks that resorted to cannibalism). He doesn't have
any Christmas lights.
On Sat, Dec 17, 2011 at 9:27 PM, atxan <atx_bus@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
Is this happening with or with out your Christmas lights being plugged in?
Jeff
Sent via iPhone
On Dec 17, 2011, at 8:58 PM, julie.hey.ho.lets.go@xxxxxxxxx wrote:
The horn is NOT a coincidence! And the fuel filter has been changed
recently, the problem was before and after that. I have checked the fuel
pump in the past too.
On Sat, Dec 17, 2011 at 8:54 PM, Duncan <whocanduncan1@xxxxxxxxx> wrote:
My bet is tyhe horn is a coincidence.
Replace the fuel filter.
_____
From: julie.hey.ho.lets.go@xxxxxxxxx
Sender: tcb-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Date: Sat, 17 Dec 2011 20:20:21 -0600
To: <tcb@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
ReplyTo: tcb@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [tcb] A very goofy gremlin
I enjoy gremlins. They challenge me. But I have one that I can't beat in
my '71. And I thought I had. He is chuckling loudly right now.
I have electronic ignition and this one has been in this Bus for 95,000
miles. And the horn is no longer the button in the steering wheel, it is a
button off to the side and it has been this way for years. Otherwise this
is a stock Bus, 1600 dual port, nothing unusual.
Sometimes he won't start. But I discovered that if I toot his horn then he
will start right up, or he will stall and not start until the horn is
tooted. This has been happening very intermittently since June. It always
happens on the way home, never first drive of the day, always after 5
o'clock (this may or may not be a clue). He never does this when there is a
mechanic or a VW friend that has knowledge greater than mine is around. I
did bring him to my mechanic a couple of months ago and he cleaned up all of
the corroded wiring that was hiding behind the dash. It was really green
and crumbly and nasty back there. We thought that would have done away with
the gremlin.
I was just a my mechanic's Tuesday morning and we were addressing another
problem. Donner drove the 70 miles there perfectly. On the way to work
after the mechanic at one point on the highway it was like we were cruising
along at a sprint and then suddenly there was a significant lose of power, I
drifted into the gas station because I needed gas anyways so once he was
filled up, he started up and made it to work like nothing happened. After
work he drove 40 miles with no problems. And then at midnight when I was
heading home he stalled in the first 1/4 mile. Started only after tooting
the horn. On the highway there were times when I would have sudden stepping
down loses of power, like I was an Olympic sprinter, then a high school
middle distance runner, then an out of shape jogger and then stall. I have
never run out of gas but I assume you would just feel a vehicle slow
smoothly as the gas runs out? It wasn't like that. And then honk the horn
and I would be able to start up again. One time as I was going through
these sudden loses of power I honked the horn and it was like a rocket
booster, he went back to normal for a little while. So today I was just
going down the road a bit so I thought I would see how Donner behaves. I
figured if worse came to worse I can just keep doing my honking trick and
make it home, this trick has consistently worked. But no. When I was going
to head home, he wouldn't start. I honked and honked and honked. Nothing.
My mechanic had me put the key in the on position and un-connect the
solenoid on the carb and it clicked so I was getting power there. And then
he had me un-plug the wire that goes to the middle of the distributor cap
and my mom would have the engine turn over while I held the wire near metal
and no spark, none at all. So I could not do the pop the clutch trick to
get started. My mechanic figured it must be the electronic ignition. So I
called AAA. While waiting the hour for the tow truck I fiddled more and
more and tooted the horn and tried and tried to get him started. Towed him
home. As soon as the tow truck left the driveway I turned Donner's key,
wouldn't start, wouldn't start, wouldn't start. Toot the horn and he starts
right up.
My mechanic says that electronic ignition problems aren't intermittent. It
either works or it doesn't.
I will try to make the 70 mile journey to my mechanic next week but I was
wondering if you guys have any ideas on how to slay this gremlin or at least
chase him a few states away. The electronic ignition? The ignition switch
(this one is about 2 years old)? Constantly beep the horn until someone
shoots me? Any other ideas?
Other related posts:
