# [tabi] Re: new electricity pricing plan (optional)

• From: "Easy Talk" <easytalk@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
• To: <tabi@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
• Date: Sun, 14 Nov 2010 18:51:27 -0500

```Hi Chip,

Someting wong here,
```
I heard FSU was starting a new class called Don't believe everything you read 101.!!!!!smile
```
```
Lets say I set my thermostat to 72 degrease and my cost is \$200 and I believe your post and set my thermostat to 80. This means I should save 96 percent of my cooling/heating cost. That means my heating cost goes from \$200 to \$8, I don't think so and if this is what is on the city web site then they should remove it since I doubt there is a single situation where this would be true.
```
Screwed again!!!smile

```
Also I don't think there is a way to accurately make a statement like this since a multi level home or a different size home would have to be factored in not to mention the out door temperature fluctuation variables.
```
Robert

```
----- Original Message ----- From: "Allison and Chip Orange" <acorange@xxxxxxxxxxx>
```To: <tabi@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2010 4:06 PM
Subject: [tabi] Re: new electricity pricing plan (optional)

```
```ok, checking on the city's web site at:

http://www.talgov.com/you/energy/tips.cfm#plan

```
they post energy saving tips from the U.S. department of energy. in short,
```you always save by setting your thermostats back when you're away (they
```
mention it costs you 12% more for every degree you leave your thermostat set
```below 80 when cooling):

"Summer:
```
Recommended indoor temperature is 78 degrees in . Set it higher when you're
```away
all day.
Winter: Recommended indoor temperature is 68 degrees. Set it lower at
night."

```
and when leaving the house they say "Summer 78 degrees (80 - 83 when away)"
```
they make it very clear: "use less and it costs less"

they also say if you have any energy questions,
route to
extension 4, then 2."

Chip

-----Original Message-----
```
From: tabi-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:tabi-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf
```Of Allison and Chip Orange
Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2010 3:44 PM
To: tabi@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [tabi] Re: new electricity pricing plan (optional)

```
you remind me of Joe Plumber there Robert; assuming government is always out
```to "screw the citizens"!

First, they don't want to build a power plant because it's very expensive,
and they'd have to borrow the money, thus making your electric rates go up
even further.  Next, they don't want to build one because no one wants a
power plant anywhere near them.  and finally, they have some of the higher
electric rates, because they have some of the lowest income from property
```
taxes, because they aren't allowed to tax state buildings at all; so there's
```all that prime business property going untaxed, and yet you expect
```
dial-a-ride, and road repairs, and audible signals, and everything else that the city needs to provide. in short, they have to get money from somewhere.
```
As for not turning your a/c down, that's just plain wrong, and is another
```
urban myth. you can call the city engineers, or the PSC engineers, and they
```will confirm that there's no such thing as "your system uses more
electricity because it has to work harder, so you actually use more
```
electricity by using less". sorry, just do some research on the internet if you don't want to call and you'll find some decent electrical engineers who
```will tell you this isn't so.  Now, don't turn your system off unless your
```
gone 3 days, that's got a grain of truth to it; but the truth is don't ever
```turn it off, just up high enough so you'll use less, but not so high that
```
your house might start growing mold or mildew. that's the only problem with
```turning it off; you'll get green stuff growing.

Chip

-----Original Message-----
```
From: tabi-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:tabi-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On Behalf
```Of Easy Talk
Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2010 9:15 AM
To: tabi@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [tabi] Re: new electricity pricing plan (optional)

```
My guess is after the pilot program, the city will decide if they are going
```to make the change or not and if they make the change we most likely won't
```
have a choice. My question is how can they tell what time we are using the
```electricity. Basically the time is in two 12 hour slots so if 1 of the
```
twelve hour slots goes up 8 cents and the other goes down four if you don't
```change your habits then it don't look to good as far as the math goes.  In
the winter nights are much colder but in the summer the days are much
hotter.  Every air condition person I have ever talked to says the most
```
efficient way to use your air condition is to set it to a comfortable level and leave it because if you raise the temperature while you are at work and
```then lower it when you come home, the system has to work harder to reduce
the temperature.  They also say not to turn it off unless you are going to
be away for 3 days or more.
```
I don't think people will change there habits in usage. Commercial business
```will really get the shaft and this change could affect whether a business
```
would choose to locate in Tallahassee or not. The last I knew, Tallahassee
```already has the highest electric rates in the state of Florida.  As the
```
population grows in the future the city will have to build more power plants
```so why not bite the bullet and quit screwing the citizens.

Robert

Robert

----- Original Message -----
From: "Joe Plummer" <joeplummer@xxxxxxx>
To: <tabi@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2010 9:39 PM
Subject: [tabi] Re: new electricity pricing plan (optional)

```
```Well this is ok if you choose to do this and can switch back to your
old plan or way if you want to but don't know if they would let you do
this and also would they start charging outrageous price to switch to
discourage you from doing the switch thing.

sign,
Joe Plummer (JP)
joeplummer@xxxxxxx

-----Original Message-----
From: tabi-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:tabi-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
Behalf Of Allison and Chip Orange
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2010 6:47 PM
To: tabi@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [tabi] Re: new electricity pricing plan (optional)

well, this is an instance where everyone benefits (working at the PSC,
this is something I'm familiar with).

The city doesn't have to pay to build a new power plant, if they can
get enough people to switch over to this new plan.  people get their
electricity at two thirds of the current price if they switch over to
the new plan.

As far as I know of, the few problem meters have been replaced with
working ones; so this is something where everyone gets some of the
money.

now, there's one way someone not paying attention can lose money: if
you switched to the new plan, the electricity you use during day-time
hours is much more expensive than if you had not changed plans; so, if
patterns, you'll end up with a higher electric bill.

If I recall, the city said 70% of people, if they signed up for the
new plan, but made no change in their usage patterns, would end up
with the same bill they have now (I think).  This was to indicate you
wouldn't have to change much to start saving money.

So, if you are looking to save every dime, I'd look into switching
(unless you have gas heat and gas hot water, in which case it won't
make much difference).

if you want it when you want it (that is, you aren't willing to wait
till night to do your wash; take your shower, etc.), then don't
switch, and keep things as they are.

Chip

-----Original Message-----
From: tabi-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:tabi-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
Behalf Of Easy Talk
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2010 6:35 PM
To: tabi@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [tabi] Re: new electricity pricing plan (optional)

Well the whole idea was to cut out the meter reader so just putting it
on the electric only, wouldn't get the job done.  The city saves, you
pay the same just like the Nova 2010 scam.
You know the four pounds of sugar at the five pound price deal.  Most
likely the new electric plan will mostly benefit the city or they
wouldn't be doing it, that's why they are doing the pilot testing to
see how much they would make.

Robert

Robert

----- Original Message -----
From: "Allison and Chip Orange" <acorange@xxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <tabi@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2010 5:57 PM
Subject: [tabi] Re: new electricity pricing plan (optional)

```
```sorry to hear about that; but I do know they have the standard manual
display still on them as a backup in cases like yours.  I had no idea
though they were doing this with water meters, I only got a notice
from the city about my electric meter.

-----Original Message-----
From: tabi-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:tabi-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
Behalf Of Easy Talk
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2010 4:49 PM
To: tabi@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [tabi] Re: new electricity pricing plan (optional)

As far as smart meters being correct, I'll have to disagree with this
since when one was installed on my rental property which was vacant
and the water was turned off at the street, I got a water bill for
\$1,800.00 and I didn't make a typo in the amount.  After fussing with
the utility department for
3
months, I finally had to call the mayors office to get it sorted out.
They
couldn't understand why the visual reading was different than what
was being sent to the computer so I suggest you get a sighted person
my case it deffentantly was noticeable but if the difference is
slight you might be getting screwed.

Robert

----- Original Message -----
From: "Allison and Chip Orange" <acorange@xxxxxxxxxxx>
To: <tabi@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2010 4:52 PM
Subject: [tabi] Re: new electricity pricing plan (optional)

```
```Joe,

I can only say you've really got just about everything screwed up in

first, yes, you can opt out at any time; that question, and all the
others you say aren't answered, are indeed answered on the web site
provided in the original email.  This question was actually answered
in the email, since I copied some of the questions from the site
into the first email.

next, nobody said anything about just having a smart meter would
lower your bill.  that wasn't claimed, because they are a standard
electric meter in every way, except that they can be read remotely
over the internet.  they do not give false readings, and they have
not caused anyone's bill to go up unjustly.  there has been no

Yes, it's possible if you go on this plan for you to have a higher
bill (if you use all your electricity during the peak daytime
hours); you do have to read and understand it before doing something
like signing up, or shooting off a reply full of misinformation.

No, having residential customers switch their usage patterns because
of this program will not change the peak load times; that's because
peak load is largely a function of commercial use (that's why
holidays are given to you at the cheaper rate, just like night time
usage).

The city does provide all of these answers on their web site, and
time of day pricing for electricity is something which has been in
common use across the country for 20 years I'd guess.

this is a way for people who have very limited amounts of money to
save a little more; you should not try and stop them from doing so
by spouting a lot of conspiracy theory, or anti-government rhetoric
which isn't backed up with any facts.  It's also a very
environmentally friendly thing to do, as it keeps us from having to
build new power plants.

Chip

-----Original Message-----
From: tabi-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:tabi-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]
On Behalf Of Joe Plummer
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2010 4:24 PM
To: tabi@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [tabi] Re: new electricity pricing plan (optional)

problem is with this is like the smart meters what if it really
ended up with a higher cost to you and two if you decided you did
not like it or it did not fit your needs could you opt out of it.
These questions have not yet been answer. Also would if enough
people got on this ban wagon wouldn't it change the peek time?  This
then would throw you in a higher electric plan.
Also the question is if your house or rental is not energy efficient
how would this effect your cost with these smart thermostat. So lots
of questions and so far no answers from the city and lots more
question that have not been listed here that has not been answered
yet. Don't forget the smart meter was supposed to lower people
electric bill and did exactly the opsit. No one has gave a good
reason why this has happen. The best answer they came up with here
is that the meter readers was not reading the meters right. Now you
are saying that the city employed meter readers that could not read
and write ? I don't think so I think the smart meters is just not
working right but guess what you can't do anything about it but pay the
```
```bill.
```
```So in my opinion is to be careful what you sign up for.

Sign,
JP ( Joe Plummer)
joeplummer@xxxxxxx

-----Original Message-----
From: tabi-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:tabi-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx]
On Behalf Of Allison and Chip Orange
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2010 2:58 PM
To: tabi@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
Subject: [tabi] new electricity pricing plan (optional)

Hi all,

below is info on the new optional electricity pricing plan.  instead
of a single price, you can switch to a plan which prices it based on
the time of day when you  use the power.

To go with this, you can purchase thermostats which automatically
change their temp settings based on the time of day, along with
electric hot water timers which do the same thing.

Chip

-------

The City Commission approved the first optional rate plan at its
October 27, 2010 meeting. This new offering is known as the Nights &
Weekends Pricing Program. As a new Energy Smart Plus program, it
offers customers an alternative rate option with a lower price on
electricity used during nights
(7 p.m. - 7 a.m.), weekends and holidays at 7.921 cents / kWh and a
higher rate during weekdays (7 a.m. - 7 p.m.) at 22.264 cents / kWh.
The program is open to 2,000 City of Tallahassee Electric customers
as a pilot from November 1, 2010 through April 30, 2012.

Q: What are the rates associated with Nights & Weekends?
A: Currently, our electricity is at 12.158 cents / kWh all day,
every day.
The new plan will be split between Daytime @ 22.264 cents / kWh and
Nights
```
```
```
```&
Weekends @ 7.921 cents / kWh. State holidays are also at the Nights
& Weekends rate of 7.921 cents / kWh.

Q: Can I stop the program at any time?
for a minimum of one year.

Q: If I leave the program will I be able to re-enroll?
A: Yes, as long as there are available spots in the program; and
you'll be required to remain on the plan for at least a full year.

Q: When does this program start?
A: Customers can start signing up on November 1, 2010.

A: Call 891.4YOU (4968) or fill out a Customer Request Form for more

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```
Check out the TABI resource web page at
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and please make suggestions for new material.

if you'd like to unsubscribe you can do so through the freelists.org web
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interface, or by sending an email to the address tabi-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
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and please make suggestions for new material.

if you'd like to unsubscribe you can do so through the freelists.org web
```
interface, or by sending an email to the address tabi-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
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```
Check out the TABI resource web page at http://acorange.home.comcast.net/TABI
```and please make suggestions for new material.

```
if you'd like to unsubscribe you can do so through the freelists.org web interface, or by sending an email to the address tabi-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with the word "unsubscribe" in the subject.
```
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