[SI-LIST] Re: soldering plastic balls
- From: steve weir <weirsi@xxxxxxxxxx>
- To: "Moreira, Jose" <jose.moreira@xxxxxxxxxx>
- Date: Tue, 05 Jun 2007 13:07:57 -0700
Jose look into what W.L. Gore has. Samtec ( disclaimer I have an
affiliation ) also demonstrated long active equalized cables at
DesignCon 2007.
Good luck.
Steve.
Moreira, Jose wrote:
> Orin, Steve
>
> On the topic of outer layer conductor for HF equalization, do you know of any
> cable assembly manufacturers having already on their portfolio this type of
> conductors available for ordering?
>
> I have read about them but I have not seen this type of conductors being used
> even on application requiring long coaxial cables for high-speed digital
> applications. I'm wondering why?
>
>
> Jose
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: si-list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx [mailto:si-list-bounce@xxxxxxxxxxxxx] On
> Behalf Of olaney@xxxxxxxx
> Sent: Dienstag, 5. Juni 2007 21:10
> To: weirsi@xxxxxxxxxx
> Cc: write2larsj@xxxxxxxxx; dan1_st@xxxxxxxxx; si-list@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
> Subject: [SI-LIST] Re: soldering plastic balls
>
> That's the same theory that works for copperweld coax conductors (copper
> plated steel). At HF the signal sees only the copper plating, at LF the
> resistance does not drop as much from the HF value, ...and it's cheaper!
>
> Orin
>
> On Tue, 05 Jun 2007 11:57:51 -0700 steve weir <weirsi@xxxxxxxxxx> writes:
>
>> Lars, the technique of using only an outer layer conductor for HF
>> equalization is well established. There is a nifty interposer
>> connector
>> technology that uses tiny silver plated nickel balls.
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>>
>> Steve.
>> Lars Juul wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Steve,
>>>
>>> I'm surprised to hear that the primary objective with the plastic
>>>
>> core
>>
>>> balls is to equalize the resistance over frequency, as Sekisui
>>>
>> write
>>
>>> on their product page:
>>>
>>> ( http://www.sekisui-fc.com/eng/html/jissou/product/jipr_02.html)
>>> ...
>>> Micropearl SOL is a solder plated true sphere with a plastic core
>>>
>> and
>>
>>> was designed for mounting chips to circuit board. Unlike
>>>
>> conventional
>>
>>> solder balls which often cracks under the heat cycle test,
>>> ...
>>>
>>> They go on to show graphs with how much longer these solderjoints
>>>
>> will
>>
>>> hold in temp cycle tests comparison to SnAg alloys, which I feel
>>>
>> is
>>
>>> very relevant in these RoHS times.
>>>
>>> However, it's true that at high frequencies the current flows on
>>>
>> the
>>
>>> edge of the conductor (in closest possible proximity to your
>>>
>> return
>>
>>> current), and that the lack of conductor diameter will lead to
>>> increased resistance closer to low frequencies, but I doubt that
>>>
>> it
>>
>>> will act as a good loss equalizer (I might be wrong, I guess)
>>>
>>>
>>> 2007/6/5, steve weir <weirsi@xxxxxxxxxx
>>>
>> <mailto:weirsi@xxxxxxxxxx>>:
>>
>>> Lars, the idea of the plastic balls is that they have only a
>>>
>> thin
>>
>>> outer
>>> conducting layer and therefore the resistance remains much
>>>
>> more
>>
>>> uniform
>>> and therefore equalizing loss across a broad frequency range.
>>>
>>> Steve.
>>> Lars Juul wrote:
>>> > Hi David,
>>> > I would call up your packaging vendor and ask them to make a
>>> test build with
>>> > ball samples from Sekisui on existing 10 Gbps BGAs, provided
>>>
>> the
>>
>>> ball attach
>>> > tool is suitable for this. This is usually the stumbling
>>>
>> block,
>>
>>> as this is
>>> > very expensive in NRE.
>>> >
>>> > Alternatively, it's worth exploring if you make a manual
>>>
>> ball attach
>>
>>> > (possible if the packages are for small form factor 10Gbps
>>>
>> CDRs, for
>>
>>> > instance) by printing solder paste on the package lands
>>>
>> first,
>>
>>> and then
>>> > manually place the balls on the paste by a trained person
>>>
>> with
>>
>>> a steady
>>> > hand. I assure you, crazier things have been made.
>>> >
>>> > On the other hand, my only concern with this kind of balls
>>>
>> would
>>
>>> be the
>>> > suitability for them in the power supply, as I imagine the
>>> current carrying
>>> > capabilities are somewhat limited if you have a plastc core
>>>
>> on
>>
>>> the inside.
>>> > (I don't think it's possible to attach solid solder and
>>>
>> plastic
>>
>>> balls on
>>> > specific lands on the package in a high volume setup, yet)
>>> >
>>> > PS: you're asking whether they work at 10GHz, which is a
>>>
>> single
>>
>>> frequency
>>> > point, I think it's feasible to use plastic core balls for a
>>> narrowband
>>> > application, but if it's broadband from 0 to 10e9 Hz you're
>>> driving at, I'd
>>> > say, try it out in practise first to see if it flies, then
>>>
>> make
>>
>>> a full wave
>>> > or macromodel of package afterwards to feed the chip I/O
>>>
>> designers.
>>
>>> >
>>> > Have fun.
>>> >
>>> > Best regards,
>>> > Lars
>>> >
>>> > 2007/6/5, david stern <dan1_st@xxxxxxxxx
>>> <mailto:dan1_st@xxxxxxxxx>>:
>>> >
>>> >> hello all
>>> >>
>>> >> I was looking for bga soldering balls technology for an
>>> >> application working at 5GHz to 10GHZ and and found
>>> >> soldering plastic balls from SEKISUI. Did somebody work
>>>
>> with
>>
>>> them at
>>> >> 10Ghz?
>>> >>
>>> >> Thanks
>>> >>
>>> >> David
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> ---------------------------------
>>> >> Moody friends. Drama queens. Your life? Nope! - their life,
>>> your story.
>>> >> Play Sims Stories at Yahoo! Games.
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>> >> To unsubscribe from si-list:
>>> >> si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> <mailto:si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> with 'unsubscribe' in
>>>
>> the
>>
>>> Subject field
>>> >>
>>> >> or to administer your membership from a web page, go to:
>>> >> //www.freelists.org/webpage/si-list
>>> >>
>>> >> For help:
>>> >> si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> <mailto:si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> with 'help' in the
>>>
>> Subject
>>
>>> field
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> List technical documents are available at:
>>> >> http://www.si-list.net
>>> >>
>>> >> List archives are viewable at:
>>> >> //www.freelists.org/archives/si-list
>>> >> or at our remote archives:
>>> >>
>>>
>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-list/messages
>>
>>> >> Old (prior to June 6, 2001) list archives are viewable at:
>>> >> http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>> > To unsubscribe from si-list:
>>> > si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> <mailto:si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> with 'unsubscribe' in
>>>
>> the
>>
>>> Subject field
>>> >
>>> > or to administer your membership from a web page, go to:
>>> > //www.freelists.org/webpage/si-list
>>> <//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-list>
>>> >
>>> > For help:
>>> > si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx
>>> <mailto:si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx> with 'help' in the
>>>
>> Subject
>>
>>> field
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > List technical documents are available at:
>>> > http://www.si-list.net
>>> >
>>> > List archives are viewable at:
>>> > //www.freelists.org/archives/si-list
>>> <//www.freelists.org/archives/si-list>
>>> > or at our remote archives:
>>> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-list/messages
>>> > Old (prior to June 6, 2001) list archives are viewable at:
>>> > http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>>
>> ------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To unsubscribe from si-list:
>> si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'unsubscribe' in the Subject
>> field
>>
>> or to administer your membership from a web page, go to:
>> //www.freelists.org/webpage/si-list
>>
>> For help:
>> si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'help' in the Subject field
>>
>>
>> List technical documents are available at:
>> http://www.si-list.net
>>
>> List archives are viewable at:
>> //www.freelists.org/archives/si-list
>> or at our remote archives:
>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-list/messages
>> Old (prior to June 6, 2001) list archives are viewable at:
>> http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe from si-list:
> si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'unsubscribe' in the Subject field
>
> or to administer your membership from a web page, go to:
> //www.freelists.org/webpage/si-list
>
> For help:
> si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'help' in the Subject field
>
>
> List technical documents are available at:
> http://www.si-list.net
>
> List archives are viewable at:
> //www.freelists.org/archives/si-list
> or at our remote archives:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-list/messages
> Old (prior to June 6, 2001) list archives are viewable at:
> http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu
>
>
>
>
>
------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe from si-list:
si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'unsubscribe' in the Subject field
or to administer your membership from a web page, go to:
//www.freelists.org/webpage/si-list
For help:
si-list-request@xxxxxxxxxxxxx with 'help' in the Subject field
List technical documents are available at:
http://www.si-list.net
List archives are viewable at:
//www.freelists.org/archives/si-list
or at our remote archives:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/si-list/messages
Old (prior to June 6, 2001) list archives are viewable at:
http://www.qsl.net/wb6tpu
Other related posts:
