Peggy, At this time, I would have to go with TYPE, we as a fancy have bred for the almighty sidegait so much that have destroyed TYPE in many lines. Sorry, don't like ugly, or fadey, or lack of secondary sex characteristics, even our bitches are too refined in many cases, and males are snipey. People say the German dogs have roached backs, and yes many do, but I will tell you true, the only roached dogs staying here are interestingly ....American, lol. Nope the public doesn't give a damn about sidegait, they think it's something they go through to get to the backyard. lol We need both, but give me pretty, or handsome, anyday and twice on Sunday over a great sidegaiter that is UGLY. Kathy WEBSITE UPDATED: NOV 6, 2005 _http://www.victorygermanshepherds.com_ (http://www.victorygermanshepherds.com/) VICTORY GSDs, There Is Something In A Name ============================================================================ POST is Copyrighted 2005. All material remains the property of the original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE PROSECUTED. For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx VISIT OUR WEBSITE - http://www.showgsd.org ============================================================================