Carolyn, You put this so well. Some ARE most gifted than others when it comes to the formal critique. But, most knowledgeable judges can tell an owner or the handler, in their own words, the reasons for their placements. In many cases I tell the handler why I placed their dog/bitch 2nd, 3rd, or 4th particularly when the handler appears disturbed. Several years ago at a large Specialty following a Futurity, a very well known handler informed me that I was the only judge that had not placed this dog first in his class (18 Months). Owner was REALLY UPSET on the outside of the ring. I replied I could not buy the rear, and did he not see it? . The handler replied yes, he knew, but that all the other judges put the dog up and therefore I must be wrong, and he meant in the eyes of the owner. When I say the owner was upset that is putting it mildly. ----- Original Message ----- From: carolyn mckenna To: nancy@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx ; showgsd-l@xxxxxxxxxxxxx Sent: Sunday, December 10, 2006 11:09 AM Subject: Re: [ SHOWGSD-L ] critiques You are so right, Nancy. In those days most were open to learning as well as eager to learn as much as they could. Judges who did critique their placements were confident in their knowledge of the breed and were respected for that knowledge. Eloquence is not necessary to explain the reason for one dog placing over another, just knowledge and integrity.l Carolyn Nancy Harper <nancy@xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx> wrote: In 1964 Reginald Cleveland judged the St. Louis Specialty. After judging each class, Reginald used a mike and he had each 1st thru 4th place go around the ring and as the dog or bitch gaited he gave a very through critique on the movement and then WHY that particular dog or bitch moved in the manner that it did. I had shown my German Import in Veterans, GV Bonnie Bergere(sp - sorry) of Ken Rose, at the age of 8 years, was there, and went BOB> No one could have been offended as the critique was so professional and the manner was gracious. There were 53 bitches in the open class alone. Noah Bloomer was there, owner -breeder of GV Alert of Mi-Noah's and the two men had an open discussion with breeders and exhibitors afterwards. Great knowledge. Nancy ============================================================================ POST is Copyrighted 2006. All material remains the property of the original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE PROSECUTED. For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx VISIT OUR WEBSITE - URL temporarily deleted due to AOL issues ============================================================================ ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Want to start your own business? Learn how on Yahoo! Small Business. ============================================================================ POST is Copyrighted 2006. All material remains the property of the original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE PROSECUTED. For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx VISIT OUR WEBSITE - URL temporarily deleted due to AOL issues ============================================================================