In a message dated 2/25/2006 3:41:59 A.M. Eastern Standard Time, MontanosaGSD@xxxxxxx writes: Thanks everyone for your help. I went ahead and rushed her to emergency. They gave her a shot, but unfortunately, the little girl was breach and didn't make it. At least the others are fat and sassy and Mom is doing great. No C-section which makes me happy. Thanks again. Kim Kim, maybe others could share their experiences, but I find that half or so of our GSD puppies are born breech. (I had one recently, not breech, but who presented out of the sack, belly up, had her head bent to the side and wanted to come out one shoulder first. Now that was a weird one, and yes, thank God, she's fine.) Breech puppies in the sack don't cause mom a problem. If you aren't sure how, speak with someone about how to help with the breech puppies that are out of the sack. I find a bar towel works best (the thin ones used on fine glassware, no lint, not at all slippery even when they are soaked w/ fluids and they aren't bulky), you reach up and gently hold on to both feet w/ the towel through a contraction and gently ease the puppy towards the mom's belly (not out or straight down). As you ease the puppy out, you'll be able to move the towel further up toward the hips/midsection and not be tugging on their legs. When you have both feet, though, you can't let go or after the contraction the puppy could go up inside mom and be out of reach until the next contraction, and if that happens you just might not have enough time to get the puppy out alive. You need both legs to do this though, and unfortunately, what you will sometimes see w/ breech puppies (out of the sack) is they may get a leg caught over top of the bitch's pelvic bone, present with one back leg only, with the other leg trapping the umbilical cord against the pelvic bone and if you don't get them out of there fast (NOT always possible), they suffocate....so in a situation where you can only see/ feel one back foot, you'll have to try with your index finger and loop the other back leg back over the pelvic bone before you can proceed. If you are lucky enough to do that, don't let go! I asked the list a while back how others used pit and or calcium. Experiences varied widely. I will tell you this, though. I won't whelp a litter without pit on hand. The next time you whelp a litter, have some on hand from your vet. It's a big guessing game when and how much, and like I said, individual experiences vary widely (prayer is a must too, that you are making the right call!), but talk to your vet for instruction. At a minimum, when you think they are finished, 1cc will clean out any placentas that weren't passed and this way you aren't running to the vet w/ a new mom and babies and/or risking infection from something left inside mom. Enjoy your babies! Kathy ============================================================================ POST is Copyrighted 2006. All material remains the property of the original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE PROSECUTED. For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx VISIT OUR WEBSITE - URL temporarily deleted due to AOL issues ============================================================================