In a message dated 1/23/2007 3:10:05 P.M. Pacific Standard Time, Ketchy@xxxxxxxxxx writes: "typey" due to them not having a black saddle! Excuse me, but since when did type have ANYTHING to do with color? Did I misread that or am I just plain nuts? (Don't answer that!) LOL! Penny in NY No Penny, not nuts. But in a sense a part of breed type is color, rich pigments preferred. Not just talking about black, because you can have a bi color with poor pigment. We have all seen them the "white" legs, same for a dark b/t...if the lighter areas are washed out , I wouldn't consider the dog to have good pigment. Some judges (esp some AB judges) cannot see a dark dog. Not because they are lessor dogs, but because when they think GSDs...they think saddleback..period. Look at a large percentage of the general public, they many times, will ask "What kind of dog is that?" of is that a GSD? when they see a dark b/t or a bi color, or even a solid black. It just doesn't compute to them. Type is what makes a GSD a GSD in look...well set ears, dark eyes, rich pigment, strong secondary sex characteristics...etc. It is what makes a given breed unique and distinguishable. Some of the traits of "type" may be open to opinion or preference. Personally I love a dark dog (Nitro, Levi , Oakley, Callie) and some prefer the saddle backs. That is preference. What is not open to interpretation is maleness, or femininity. You shouldn't have to look underneath to determine a dogs sex. But good breed type in any dog is just that, obvious, glorious, and makes the observer go "Now THAT's a beautiful....(fill in the blank). Sometimes as with great GSDs breed type also (imho) a character, a way of being, a look, a demeanor, a way of carrying him or herself. Breed type is something that is often sacraficed in the name of the Almighty Side Gait, along with temperament, and physical soundness....Breed type is what you remember as a kid, that attracted you to a given breed. It is also what the public wants, and holds dear in our breed, along with trainability and loyalty. It is something that far too often is lacking in the ring. But boy when a dog has it.....it is a wonderful thing to see. Kathy Tank _Victory German Shepherds_ (http://www.victorygermanshepherds.com/index.htm) ~ WEBSITE UPDATED: DEC 14, 2006 Home of CH. ELVASTON'S NATIONS CUP, TC, OFA H/E DNA'D "NITRO" 26 BISS/ BESTS OF BREED TO DATE 2006 PACIFIC COAST VICTOR ============================================================================ POST is Copyrighted 2006. All material remains the property of the original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE PROSECUTED. For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxxx VISIT OUR WEBSITE - www.showgsd.org ============================================================================