Well, that's you and if everyone in the middle of the ring did the same we wouldn't need a test. How many times have you seen poor temperament overlooked/rewarded? As for socialization, I still think it's important. I agree, it's not going to change character, but I don't think it's quite fair for a dog to be pulled out of a pen and thrown into van, wet down, blown out, handed off to a stranger, subject to bells, whistles etc. and be expected to show their true colors. It might work, it might not. Why leave anything to chance? Do you thing the horses that will start in the derby this weekend have been over to the paddock on non-race day a few times? Do you think they've practiced in the gate??? (Rhetorical question; horses need a "gate card" before being eligible to be entered.) I prefer to take a baby to a handful of classes, a handful of children's sporting practices etc. and make everything fun. And I've got house dogs lol. But not all dogs live underfoot, I get that. Kathy, member GSDCA, DVGSDC Celebrating generations of Dual Titled TC'd Champions visit _http://www.pinehillgsds.com/_ (http://www.pinehillgsds.com/) In a message dated 5/4/2011 9:13:27 P.M. Eastern Daylight Time, carolynmckenna@xxxxxxxxx writes: Temperament in our breed is most important, but the observer at a F/M islaughable. A knowledgeable and honest judge will determine a dog's temperamentimmediately. I am so adamant about temperament in the GSD, that I do noteven feel that socialization is a viable option. A dog that has to be socialized does not have the mind or instinctive character of a GSD. Character is forever;training can fail. Carolyn ============================================================================ POST is Copyrighted 2011. All material remains the property of the original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. Each Author is responsible for the content of his/her post. This group and its administrators are not responsible for the comments or opinions expressed in any post. ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE PROSECUTED. For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxx VISIT OUR WEBSITE - http://showgsd.org SUBSCRIPTION:http://showgsd.org/mail.html NATIONAL BLOG - http://gsdnational.blogspot.com/ ============================================================================ ============================================================================ POST is Copyrighted 2011. All material remains the property of the original author and of GSD Communication, Inc. NO REPRODUCTIONS or FORWARDS of any kind are permitted without prior permission of the original author AND of the Showgsd-l Management. ALL RIGHTS RESERVED. Each Author is responsible for the content of his/her post. This group and its administrators are not responsible for the comments or opinions expressed in any post. ALL PERSONS ARE ON NOTICE THAT THE FORWARDING, REPRODUCTION OR USE IN ANY MANNER OF ANY MATERIAL WHICH APPEARS ON SHOWGSD-L WITHOUT THE EXPRESS PERMISSION OF ALL PARTIES TO THE POST AND THE LIST MANAGEMENT IS EXPRESSLY FORBIDDEN, AND IS A VIOLATION OF LAW. VIOLATORS OF THIS PROHIBITION WILL BE PROSECUTED. For assistance, please contact the List Management at admin@xxxxxxxxxxx VISIT OUR WEBSITE - http://showgsd.org SUBSCRIPTION:http://showgsd.org/mail.html NATIONAL BLOG - http://gsdnational.blogspot.com/ ============================================================================